In Camera Sharpening

[bob williams]

Assuming you want sharp images, what are the ups and downs of maximizing sharpness settings in camera? And if you do maximize the sharpness settings in camera, is it necessary to sharpen in post?


your guidance is appreciated





Bob

[Oren]

I guess you shoot JPEG... right?

[bob williams]

I guess you shoot JPEG... right?
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Nope, I shoot Raw and normaly keep the sharpeness set at 3 or 4 on my 50 D.

[Oren]

Then why do you have a problem? leave the default setting as it is and then play with it when its on your PC.

[bob williams]

Then why do you have a problem? leave the default setting as it is and then play with it when its on your PC.
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I really don't have a problem and I usually do sharpen in post--although, i am not very good at it yet---but if i can reduce post processing time by letting the camera do most or all of of the sharpening, then why not simply bump up the sharpness setting?

[Daniel Browning]

Assuming you want sharp images, what are the ups and downs of maximizing sharpness settings in camera? And if you do maximize the sharpness settings in camera, is it necessary to sharpen in post?


Since you shoot raw, there are no downsides, but there are at least two benefits to maximizing sharpness in camera:

The preview JPEG is sharpened more, making it easier to review on the LCD to see if you nailed critical focus or not.
The raw metadata is set closer to where you want it to be when you get to post processing, but only if you use a raw converter that detects and uses the metadata, such as DPP. This saves time and lets you make decisions about the photo when you take it rather than some point later.




While we're talking about sharpening, let's discuss a separate point: what are the upsides and downsides of sharpening in general (whether in camera JPEG or raw converter)? That's a pretty big question, but one of the times when it's good to avoid sharpening is when noise is high, because it makes the noise worse. Some people work around this issue by using increased noise reduction, so they can still sharpen. (Personally, I prefer no noise reduction and no sharpening.)

[clemmb]

(Personally, I prefer no noise reduction and no sharpening.)
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So, does this mean you set your picture style to Neutral? Standard? Custom?





Mark

[bob williams]

Thanks Daniel, Very Helpful

[Daniel Browning]

So, does this mean you set your picture style to Neutral? Standard? Custom?


I wish I could, but my raw converters (Adobe, mostly) ignore the Canon metadata. If I used DPP, I would use a variety of picture profile settings:

For typical low ISO shots: Neutral, 0 sharpening, -2 contrast, -2 saturation (no NR)

Typical high ISO shots: Neutral, -4 sharpening, -2 contrast, -2 saturation (no NR)
Sometimes: Neutral, 0 sharpening, 0 contrast, 0 saturation

[HiFiGuy1]

Daniel,


Why the differences? Also, what body do you use? Don't you have a 5D Mark II? With a 40D like mine, what are your suggestions, and how does one go about quickly changing from one set of selections to the next, on the fly?


FYI, I have been using the "Sometimes" setting all the time so far.

[clemmb]

So, does this mean you set your picture style to Neutral? Standard? Custom?


I wish I could, but my raw converters (Adobe, mostly) ignore the Canon metadata. If I used DPP, I would use a variety of picture profile settings:

For typical low ISO shots: Neutral, 0 sharpening, -2 contrast, -2 saturation (no NR)

Typical high ISO shots: Neutral, -4 sharpening, -2 contrast, -2 saturation (no NR)
Sometimes: Neutral, 0 sharpening, 0 contrast, 0 saturation




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Daniel,


I have the 5D. I do not see any negative sharpeing setting. I see 0 to 7. The Standard style has sharpening at 3. This is what I usually use.


Mark

[bob williams]

I wish I could, but my raw converters (Adobe, mostly) ignore the Canon metadata. If I used DPP, I would use a variety of picture profile settings:





Daniel, I use Lightroom2 ---Does your statement mean that Lighroom ignores the Canon Metadata, specifically picture style settings and NR settings. If this is the case, it serves no purpose to use picture style settings ---is this correct?

[nickds7]

I agree with using 3 and going from there, unless in high iso settings. You can just have lightroom do all the same things that your camera does by using presets Ibelieve

[Johnny Rasmussen]

Hi Bob,


I shoot raw like you but sometimes when I want quick&amp;easy conversions I use Raw Image Task, part of ZoomBrowser. It mimics in-camera jpeg quite well and I get sharp natural looking images. I don&acute;t use it often but but when I do I am very pleased with the conversion.





- Johnny

[Daniel Browning]

Why the differences?





It's just a matter of personal taste. I prefer shots with less sharpening over NR with sharpening.



Don't you have a 5D Mark II?


Yes.



how does one go about quickly changing from one set of selections to the next, on the fly?


There is a picture style button on the back of the camera. Press that once, then use the scroll wheel to quickly pick a different style and press OK.



With a 40D like mine, what are your suggestions?


It's really a matter of personal taste. I prefer shots with low contrast and low sharpening (I mostly sharpen at output). The Canon Picture Style editor is a really neat way to build your own custom style.

[Daniel Browning]

Daniel, I use Lightroom2 ---Does your statement mean that Lighroom ignores the Canon Metadata, specifically picture style settings and NR settings.





Yes, Lightroom ignores it.



If this is the case, it serves no purpose to use picture style settings ---is this correct?


Correct. There's no purpose unless you use something like DPP.

[bob williams]

Thanks Daniel, This is certainly info that was left out of both the Lightroom and Canon user manuals[^o)]

[HiFiGuy1]

Why the differences?





It's just a matter of personal taste. I prefer shots with less sharpening over NR with sharpening.



Don't you have a 5D Mark II?


Yes.



how does one go about quickly changing from one set of selections to the next, on the fly?


There is a picture style button on the back of the camera. Press that once, then use the scroll wheel to quickly pick a different style and press OK.



With a 40D like mine, what are your suggestions?


It's really a matter of personal taste. I prefer shots with low contrast and low sharpening (I mostly sharpen at output). The Canon Picture Style editor is a really neat way to build your own custom style.






Thanks for the info on changing settings quickly. I'll look into that further on my camera. I understand that you like low contrast and low sharpening in your RAW files, but I want to know why. I also use 0 sharpening in my shots, but I don't decrease other settings to get "low" contrast, for example. Why would you do that? Is there a technical reason, something that gives latitude for improvement in post processing that would not be available otherwise? I appreciate the artistic perspective, but I know you well enough to know that there is an underlying technical basis for this decision.


Also, the Picture Style editor is in DPP, correct? Or is it in camera?

[Daniel Browning]

Is there a technical reason, something that gives latitude for improvement in post processing that would not be available otherwise? I appreciate the artistic perspective, but I know you well enough to know that there is an underlying technical basis for this decision.


[:D] It's really just artistic. If you're shooting JPEG (or video), then there is a good technical reason: you can always add contrast in post, but you can't take it away. But for raw there's really no technical reason, since it can all be changed later.



Also, the Picture Style editor is in DPP, correct?


Actually, it's a separate program that you can download for free from Canon. Once you create your style (or download one that someone else created) you can transfer it to the Camera with the flash card or USB cable.


Canon just came out with a new version two weeks ago. Here is one location where you can download it:


http://software.canon-europe.com/software/0037091.asp ("http://software.canon-europe.com/software/0037091.asp)

[HiFiGuy1]

Thanks DB,


I shoot RAW or RAW+JPEG, so I should just ignore all this I guess! Oh well. [:D]


I am going to check into the software. That sounds really neat, even if it is apparently for the in-camera JPEGs.