Need help with Black and White conversion

[Sheiky]

Hey there,


30 september I need to shoot a wedding. And the couple also wants some black and white shots. The fact is that I have a hard time coming up with a proper black/white photo. I just can't seem to get a nice and good toned black-white photo.


Are there any programs/plug-inns you use? I'm very curious on how you do it, because I think beautiful black and white is a true art which I don't poses.


At least pushing the sliders to monochrome in Lightroom doesn't really work out that well.


I use Lightroom 3 and CS5.


Thanks!


Jan

[cfnz]

Are you not happy with any of the default Lightroom 3 B&W presets?

[Johnny Rasmussen]

Agree, black and white is a true art. I have been working with B&W the last 2-3 years and have come to see it that way.


I have been using the same plug-in for almost 3 years now, it is called B&W Styler, you can see for your self if you like it http://thepluginsite.com/products/photowiz/bwstyler/index.htm ("http://thepluginsite.com/products/photowiz/bwstyler/index.htm)


Some people prefer this some prefer that when it comes to B&W conversion. I think the key is to make best use of the tools you have.





- Johnny

[Sheiky]

Are you not happy with any of the default Lightroom 3 B&W presets?






Nah I tried all of them, but they don't give me the look I want. There's always something not right and in most of those cases I'm not directly sure of what to change so it looks better.






Agree, black and white is a true art. I have been working with B&W the last 2-3 years and have come to see it that way.


I have been using the same plug-in for almost 3 years now, it is called B&W Styler, you can see for your self if you like it http://thepluginsite.com/products/photowiz/bwstyler/index.htm ("http://thepluginsite.com/products/photowiz/bwstyler/index.htm)





I'll check it out when my pc is up and running again. Need to re-install everything this afternoon or tomorrow, but so far it looks good.



Some people prefer this some prefer that when it comes to B&W conversion. I think the key is to make best use of the tools you have.


I know and therefor I'd like to get as many tips as possible [:D] I really struggle with black and white so all help is welcome.


I tried to make a portrait of a baby in black and white, but I couldn't get a good one. Mainly because sometimes the baby looked more dead than alive in my black and white attempts while I have seen great black and white shots of babies...sigh...time to practice!


Thanks already and all other input is welcome!


Jan

[Johnny Rasmussen]

Jan,


The way I see it you can make two sorts of images, the technical correct ones and the artistic ones. I have been playing several musical instruments since the mid -70´s and improvisation is what I like most. When I started to work on b&w images I first tried to make everything technical correct. They were ok, but not what I wanted. Then I decided to stop thinking about if it is technical correct or not and started to focus on the artistic aspect. ( Improvisation ) Then I got much better results.


My suggestion: Do not focus on the tools right now. It does not matter if you are using Lightroom, Photoshop or a plug-in. Instead go buy a book or go to the library and get a book with lots of b&w images. Study them, pick the ones you like, then try to replicate the ones you like. When you master that you have come a long way.


In order to make great b&w´s you need an idea to work from, a starting point. That´s where a book filled with b&w images can come in handy. Every time I start working on an b&w image I study it carefully until I get a clear idea what I want do to with it. It can take several weeks from the shooting till I start working on it. My lesson is this: No clear idea = no good result. (Most of the time )


Lightroom is a nice tool by the way. I am using it now and then. The b&w conversion tool in combination with brushes and dodge&burn will cover most of your needs. My most used b&w tools are the plug-in mentioned and dodge and burn in Photoshop.


You can of course buy "one-click" plug-ins and scroll through a list of presets. It can be a starting point and help you get going.


There are no short cuts I´m afraid, just a lot of work ahead if you want great b&w images. ( But you already know that.. )[:)]





- Johnny

[Lars]

There are a lot of books out there that can be recommended. I know that Michael Freeman writes books that are easy to understand for amateurs like myself (you are perhaps a few steps above amateur?). You could check that out, it is available on amazon (haven't read it myself): The Complete Guide to Digital Black and White Photography (Complete Guides) <span class="ptBrand"]by Michael Freeman. If you come across another easy guide for B&amp;W photpgraphy, let me know, I am always interested in gaining more knowledge on digital photography.


Lars

[andnowimbroke]

Are there any programs/plug-inns you use


http://www.kubotaimagetools.com/actions.html ("http://www.kubotaimagetools.com/actions.html)


Heard this guy was pretty good with his plugins, but do agree B&amp;W photos are subjective.

[rzFoto]

B&amp;W reqiues different lighting than color - something software can't do. Nevertheless, I have some actions that might be useful to you. I can email to you if you are interested.


Richard

[Sheiky]

Hey people, thanks for replying!



My suggestion: Do not focus on the tools right now. It does not matter if you are using Lightroom, Photoshop or a plug-in. Instead go buy a book or go to the library and get a book with lots of b&amp;w images. Study them, pick the ones you like, then try to replicate the ones you like. When you master that you have come a long way.


I guess that's a good idea as well, Johnny. Now that you mention it, I have a book and I'm pretty sure it mentions a chapter about B&amp;W...can't believe I never thought of that



The b&amp;w conversion tool in combination with brushes and dodge&amp;burn will cover most of your needs. My most used b&amp;w tools are the plug-in mentioned and dodge and burn in Photoshop.


Well the point is, that I really need to know how and where to start. I guess if my start will be OK I'm more than curious enough to play around with it until I achieve what I want.



You can of course buy "one-click" plug-ins and scroll through a list of presets. It can be a starting point and help you get going.


After that I have no clue what to change [:P]



There are no short cuts I&acute;m afraid, just a lot of work ahead if you want great b&amp;w images. ( But you already know that.. )/emoticons/emotion-1.gif


Yeah well I didn't expect anything like that, but of course it would be nice [:D]



There are a lot of books out there that can be recommended
<div>Thanks for the suggestion Lars, although English is not my native language and so English books aren't always available here. I'll start with what I have and keep searching.</div>
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you are perhaps a few steps above amateur?


Nah definitely not in any aspect and when it comes to portraiture and B&amp;W I'm a total newbie [:D] but that's ok [:P]



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If you come across another easy guide for B&amp;W photpgraphy, let me know, I am always interested in gaining more knowledge on digital photography.


Will do!










Are there any programs/plug-inns you use


http://www.kubotaimagetools.com/actions.html ("http://www.kubotaimagetools.com/actions.html)


Heard this guy was pretty good with his plugins, but do agree B&amp;W photos are subjective.





Looks great! But...kinda expensive I think...at least for my kind of usage. Thanks for the tip!









B&amp;W reqiues different lighting than color - something software can't do. Nevertheless, I have some actions that might be useful to you. I can email to you if you are interested.


Richard





That would be great Richard! I will PM you [:D]


Thanks again everybody and still every tip and hint is welcome!


Jan






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