View Full Version : I am sure it is a dumb quenstion but I could use your help....
OK, so thanks to the advise of all of you i decided to go and get a70-200L f/4 IS for my zoom as a kit to my 40D. I have 17-85 IS and will be also getting 50mm some time soon.
Dumb question: I am very new to SLR and to photography in general, and I do not know how would I be able to tell if the lens I purchase is good...
If I only "play" with my camera at this time, very slowly learning, what would be the best way to test this lens to make sure it is not defective in any way?
Do you think I should wait until I get better with my skills...which may not happen until next century[:'(]
Or should I just go for it knowing this kind of lens is generally good and reliable?
Or is there an easy way to tell there is something wrong with it?
Any help will be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance and I apologize if this is too dumb for this forum[:$] I have nowhere else to go...
peety3
04-16-2009, 10:49 AM
Put camera and lens on a tripod. Shoot a scene that would show focus errors (i.e. at least three objects, one straight ahead of the lens, one closer and to the left, one farther and to the right) that will not move (concrete, glass, wood - no fabrics that will blow) at apertures from f/22 to wide open at one-stop intervals. Take those pictures using mirror lockup and 2-second or 10-second timer. Look for focus errors as your shots approach wide-open, and other than a mild loss of sharpness/clarity in the corners (you'll have to read reviews to know how much to expect) you should be expecting crisp photos all the way to wide-open.
In other words, take shake out of the equation as best as you can. Only if you know the lens can perform should you then start to judge how well IS works (if the lens has IS). And don't have overly high expectations - I've had the 50mm f/1.8 for 1.5 years. Only last fall did I re-read the review and find out that it's not sharp until f/2.8. Now that I know that, I can produce some great results.
Hey BES, this is a bit off topic, but I'm about to get the 50D I believe and not quite sure about the lens. I think it'd be the 17-85 for now, but I'm just not sure. Could you please send me some of your shots with this lens? (I'm talking about the original files straight out of the camera - JPEGs if possible)
Thanks; and don't forget to have fun with your new toy (...the 40D [:D]).
Hey BES, this is a bit off topic, but I'm about to get the 50D I believe and not quite sure about the lens. I think it'd be the 17-85 for now, but I'm just not sure. Could you please send me some of your shots with this lens? (I'm talking about the original files straight out of the camera - JPEGs if possible)
Thanks; and don't forget to have fun with your new toy (...the 40D /emoticons/emotion-2.gif).
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hi Oren
I purchased 50mm f/1.4. I had no time to even try it on, I will do it on weekend.
Sure I can send you some shots, they are not the best but it is not the lens, it is ME, [:'(]
How do I send them to you? I have no problems with forwarding some shots. It will have to wait till evening or morning but I can certainly do it. I have them on my home computer and I am at work right now--lunch break. By the way, the shots I posted in my first post were not at all altered, they were straight from the camera, no photoshoping or else as I do not even know how to use it yet. I have Photoshop Elements but every time I tried something (honestly, I think I spent a total of 30 minutes in it) I turned original into something scandalously goofy and ugly. Again, operator error here. I had no time to read the book or anything, I work for living and time is a very limited comodity these days. I know some people do magic with photoshop, I'd like to learn this skill, but for now I need to learn my camera and how to take pictures before I learn how to fix what I messed up or enhance things. By the way, I was agonizing over which one to get at the time when 40D came out and was not sure if not to go with Nikon D80. When I got my recent lens and tried now both cameras for size and "feeling", I am glad I made decision to go with 40D, it feels better although heavier. For woman it is a big deal, I think I need to start working out. God help me when I pop a flash on top of it! Carpal tunnel for sure!
devsalvi
04-16-2009, 05:18 PM
Hi BES,
I thought i should mention this since you are starting off with your new 40d and this is what i did when i first got my hands on my 40d. If you look at the image galleries on this site (http://www.the-digital-picture.com/Gallery/), Bryan provides exif data (shutter speed, aperture, focal lenght and iso) besides the image. It gives a good idea of what setting work for what kinds of pictures. Again, these will NOT always work because of the unique light conditions. But i think its a good place to start experimenting.
Cheers!
Dev
Hi BES,
I thought i should mention this since you are starting off with your new 40d and this is what i did when i first got my hands on my 40d. If you look at the image galleries on this site (http://www.the-digital-picture.com/Gallery/), Bryan provides exif data (shutter speed, aperture, focal lenght and iso) besides the image. It gives a good idea of what setting work for what kinds of pictures. Again, these will NOT always work because of the unique light conditions. But i think its a good place to start experimenting.
Cheers!
Dev
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Great tip, thanks! it takes me half an hour to set something up though, i do not know my cemera yet [:$] it is awful that I am sooo slow.
devsalvi
04-16-2009, 06:10 PM
You are welcome BES.
Hey BES, I don't see a private message feature here so I guess mail could work too.
The only problem with mail is spam - so I'll give you my 2nd mail and not my main. I never check this mail anymore so once you send the pictures please let me know. This is my mail: clicknet (at gmail com)
I tried to avoid from more spam so I wrote it this way as seen above, I hope you understand the address.
If possible, send me photos at ISO 400, 800, 1600. 3200 would be great too if not too hard. Since it's 100%, the files might be very big, if that is a problem then just send one at ISO 800 and one at 1600.
Thanks again BES, I really appreciate it.
Rodger
04-19-2009, 02:48 AM
BES,
Im going off topic from your original question. Sorry.
You mentioned that youaren'tvery good with photoshop. (Neitheram I), but you should check into a photoshop tutorial book by Scott Kelby. I recently got "the photoshop cs book for digital photographers" and it has taught me so much. I believe there is a book for every version of photoshop (elements included), but Im not sure. You should be able to find them at Borders or Barnes and Nobel. Also, depending on what elements version you have, you might want to upgrade. Elements 7.0 is 40% off ("http://www.photoshopsupport.com/photoshop-blog/09/cs4-04/photoshop-elements-sale-discount.html) until April 23rd. Just some ideas.
When you first get everything it is very overwhelming. I got my first DSLR this past Christmas. Just shoot as much as you can and read as many tips as you can find. It will become easier and you will get faster at knowing and changing the settings to match the situation. :)
-Rodger
BES,
Im going off topic from your original question. Sorry.
You mentioned that youaren'tvery good with photoshop. (Neitheram I), but you should check into a photoshop tutorial book by Scott Kelby. I recently got "the photoshop cs book for digital photographers" and it has taught me so much. I believe there is a book for every version of photoshop (elements included), but Im not sure. You should be able to find them at Borders or Barnes and Nobel. Also, depending on what elements version you have, you might want to upgrade. Elements 7.0 is 40% off ("http://www.photoshopsupport.com/photoshop-blog/09/cs4-04/photoshop-elements-sale-discount.html) until April 23rd. Just some ideas.
When you first get everything it is very overwhelming. I got my first DSLR this past Christmas. Just shoot as much as you can and read as many tips as you can find. It will become easier and you will get faster at knowing and changing the settings to match the situation. :)
-Rodger
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Thanks Roger. That is a great advice. I want to make sure I can first take a decent picture before I can monkey with it in photo shop. But I can see it can be put into a good use and I am fascinated by what others do with it. I will take your advice to heart. I agree, it is very overwhelming. I used to just P/S, not even thinking of any settings, now I am trying and getting all confused. I am having issues with understanding the "triangle" and how to set it all right so I just keep trying. Not sure why it is so difficult for me to comprehend, I think I am just "overteching" it. But I have to say I do not have right now enough time to spend with my camera (work is busy as hell) so I just do what I can and when I can). I hope to get better just by practicing and finding out by trial and error what works. I am seriously contemplating some "photography for dummies" before I start crying [:'(]
Yesterday someone told me "if you got Nikon, you would not have any issues, you would just set it in P and let camera do the job for you". It made me feel worried that perhaps I have too complicated piece of equipment for first timer. Ugh, Nikon people should just be more supportive [;)]
You can put your 40D in P mode as well. In my opinion though, that would be waste... what's the point of having a DSLR if you shoot in P mode?? The results are still better than with P&S, but for me at least it sounds super dumb thing to do. Maybe just shoot with a 1Ds mark3 on Auto mode... [:P]
You can put your 40D in P mode as well. In my opinion though, that would be waste... what's the point of having a DSLR if you shoot in P mode?? The results are still better than with P&S, but for me at least it sounds super dumb thing to do. Maybe just shoot with a 1Ds mark3 on Auto mode... /emoticons/emotion-4.gif
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Agree...you are funny! actually you made me feel better as this is how I feel...why get this capable camera and use it as P/S?
Maybe Nikon does something different/better, but I think I can learn and think like a photographer if I use my brain and skills....it's just that it is taking me longer, LOL. I have been reading up this weekend a bit, it is somehow coming better together but it will be a long time before I will say with a certainty that the picture I took looks good because I intentionally made it that way or the other.
I need some help with ISO...any web pages that would explain well use of which ISO (on digital SLRs) in relation to aperture and shutter speed. I know it may sound basic, but I could use some tutorial. Thanks for your help and making me laugh [:D]
Colin
04-20-2009, 02:46 AM
Keep having fun, and it will all fall into place.
Aperture, ISO, and shutter speed are all related to each other in terms of light.
ISO is sensitivity to light (from the sensor/electronics standpoint, used to be the type of film)
Higher ISO is more sensitive, in proportion to the number. With a given amount of light, higher ISO will provide a brighter picture, lower ISO a darker picture.
Aperture is how large the shutter opens, expressed in a ratio to the focal length, or f/x.x. We often forget that the number is actually related to the focal length ratio, and just say '2.8' or '4' or whatever, when in fact it's actually f/2.8 or f/4.0. So, the 'larger' the short hand number, the smaller the actual aperture is. The aperture is the diameter of the opening. The light that can pass through the aperture is proportional to the area of the opening, which will be proportional to thediameter squared. So, what this means is, that everytime the aperture doubles, the light increases by a factor of 4. So, f/4 is twice as 'wide' as f/8, in terms of the diameter of the aperture. However, it lets in 4 times the light.
Shutter speed is how long the shutter is open. The amount of light passed is directly proportional to the length of time. 1/50 of a second lets in twice as much light as 1/100 of a second.
So all three of them can be manipulated to get the correct exposure, in terms of how much light, to capture the information. However, as you're learning, it's not just about how much light, because if it were, we could simply set the thing to 'Auto', or adjust a single parameter, and so long as we got a good exposure, everything would be fine.
But....
ISO changes the signal to noise ratio (and in film changes the resolution with different sizes of film grain). If you want to get into it with Daniel, he'll explain to you that changing the signal to noise ratio can also effecitively change the resolution too...
Aperture changes the depth of field (how quickly things get out of focus as you move away from that perfect distance which is 'in focus')
Shutter speed changes how much blur there will be due to motion of the camera or the subjects. You usually don't want motion blur induced by the camera (but sometimes you might), and you may or may not want motion blur created by subject movement.
But, you almost always want the correct amount of light :)
I'd suggest playing with the aperture and shutter speed with the Av and Tv modes, and maybe doing so with different ISO settings and see what happens. Manual mode is probably worth messing around with too. And check out the histogram!
Keep having fun, and it will all fall into place.
Aperture, ISO, and shutter speed are all related to each other in terms of light.
..........
I'd suggest playing with the aperture and shutter speed with the Av and Tv modes, and maybe doing so with different ISO settings and see what happens. Manual mode is probably worth messing around with too. And check out the histogram!
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Colin, thanks so much for taking your time to explain it so clearly. I really appreciate it. Are there any guidelines as to what ISO should be used with what aperture and SS---on average, before I learn what I am doing. I often make my shutter "stop", which makes me think I am not setting speed properly and I do not know how to assess it. I would like to know what are the "average" numbers to go by. What I am doing now is take a picture in idiot mode, take a look at numbers and try to duplicate settings in either P, TV or Av or M, but I cannot be as creative then and histogram is way off, in addition I am not getting the same "reaction" from my camera. Maybe there is something wrong with it in "creative" modes? I suspect it is rather "operator error" [:D]
peety3
04-20-2009, 03:52 PM
I need some help with ISO...any web pages that would explain well use of which ISO (on digital SLRs) in relation to aperture and shutter speed. I know it may sound basic, but I could use some tutorial. Thanks for your help and making me laugh /emoticons/emotion-2.gif
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ISO is the same (conceptually) whether film or digital. I often explain it by drawing a complete analogy with a water bucket and a hose:
"Fill up a one-gallon bucket with water. The wider you open the faucet, the faster the bucket fills."
The one-gallon bucket is similar to the amount of light your sensor needs to see for a proper exposure at ISO 100. The faucet opening is comparable to aperture, and the time needed to fill the bucket is shutter speed.
A half-gallon bucket becomes ISO 200, quarter-gallon is ISO 400, etc.
Does that help connect the dots?
I need some help with ISO...any web pages that would explain well use of which ISO (on digital SLRs) in relation to aperture and shutter speed. I know it may sound basic, but I could use some tutorial. Thanks for your help and making me laugh /emoticons/emotion-2.gif
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ISO is the same (conceptually) whether film or digital. I often explain it by drawing a complete analogy with a water bucket and a hose:
"Fill up a one-gallon bucket with water. The wider you open the faucet, the faster the bucket fills."
The one-gallon bucket is similar to the amount of light your sensor needs to see for a proper exposure at ISO 100. The faucet opening is comparable to aperture, and the time needed to fill the bucket is shutter speed.
A half-gallon bucket becomes ISO 200, quarter-gallon is ISO 400, etc.
Does that help connect the dots?
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this is great analogy! thanks so much! i am finally getting this stuff [:D] I think. you guys are the BEST!