7d ii

[HDNitehawk]

Sure TDP isn't that other rumor site.

But now that all the sites are claiming they have confirmed specifications I would have thought a thread would have at least popped up here.

Looking at the spec's other sites are claiming are correct, what are we seeing that is new or groundbreaking?
The interesting thing I see are the dual digic 6 processors. Processors are not talked about much but the reason (or enabler) for many of the improvements in AF and Noise were tied to them (not that a processor reduces noise but the programs it runs will). Better firm ware makes better pics I think that one is often overlooked.

I borrowed this from CR;

Specifications


All metal body
Dust and weather resistant
GPS
20.2MP CMOS sensor
10 fps
65 AF point all cross type
Dual Pixel CMOS AF
EOS iTR Autofocus
Dual DIGIC6
Max ISO 16000
RGB + IR Photometry Sensor
Intervalometer

Our Full Specifications



Kit lenses: 18-135 IS STM and 15-85 IS (no STM)
CF, UDMA mode 7 + SD, UHS-I
GPS is in the camera
No WiFi
Fixed LCD, with no touch function.
20.2MP APS-C Sensor
Dual Pixel CMOS AF
Dual DIGIC 6 Processors
65 AF points “All Cross-type”. Dual cross on the center point.
f/8 on center point at least, could be on more points.
10fps
ISO 100-16000, ISO Boost mode 25600 and 51200 (updated this to 16000)
1080p/720p both get 60fps
Servo AF for video shooting.
Anti-flicker mode, eliminates flickers under flickering lights (e.g. fluorescent lamps).
Spot metering size 1.8%
Built-in flash
Intervalometer
Mic and headphones connectors
Can sync time between 7D II cameras.
Lens electronic MF
About 100% coverage OVF
New Battery – LP-E6N
New Battery Grip BG-E16

[Kayaker72]

I think those are pretty impressive specs. I think it will make a lot of consumers happy. I am most interested in details that won't be known until there are a few hands-on reviews. What is the low-ISO/high-ISO noise like? Did they upgrade sensor tech? What is the exact benefit of IR in the AF sensor (how "dark" of light can this camera focus)? What is the general IQ in terms of sharpness and color? Is there an improvement in DR?

And I am not a DRone, but, still, what is the range of the 7D? And what is the price (rumor $1,799 to $2,199)

But, overall, that is a very solid spec list, IMO. Whether it is "exceptional" or "revolutionary" will only be known once people get their hands on it and see what it can do.

But, generally speaking, Canon hasn't missed many marks and seem to do a great job of developing cameras for a particular niche that can also be used more broadly. I know that people complain. But people always complain. I expect this to be very solid. I am not sure what it would take to get me interested in buying one. I have considered it as a less expensive way to get reach. But it would need clean ISO 3200, and I am not expecting that.

I am most interested to see what technology may arrive in it that will next show up in the 5DIV.

Until then, and maybe even after, I'll very happily shoot with my 5DIII.

[HDNitehawk]

revolutionary, I think not. I would like a smaller camera to carry in the field.

The question for me is it a legitimate replacement for the 1D IV. Will it have the same feel to the picture that the 1D bodies have, or will it be under processed files like the 7D had. Canon seems to manipulate their bodies and software so they fit the niche they are in.

It looks like the same sensor as the 70d so I would suspect that you will have about the same DR as it.
Clean ISO at 3200, I would settle for usable ISO at 3200.

You are right though, a review once it arrives will tell us more than the specs. Add quietness to the list of things I will be interested in.

One thing I want and is missing is a flip LCD, the one on the wife's t4i is very handy.

You will probably be waiting a few years for a 5DIV.

[DavidEccleston]

Kayaker, Clean at ISO 3200 depends on what you consider clean. I found the 7D usable to ISO 1600, and Canon claimed 3200 (with 6400, and 12800 as HIGH modes). Assuming I continue to accept one ISO less than Canon, then ISO 16000 / 2 = ISO 8000 should be acceptable.

I'd love to get the extra low-light capabilities over the 7D (and 1Ds2, where ISO 1600 is also the max usable setting), but yeah, I'm not jumping on it without sample images, someone doing AI Servo tests, etc.

edit: Said "/ 8" instead of "/ 2"... oops! But the intention was clear.

[HDNitehawk]

The problem with noise testing on a base camera is that it doesn't account for the processing that goes on inside the camera. To me the test is what you can do with the RAW files. Usable at 3200, the 1D IV is usable IMO. The original 7D is not IMO. Anything above 3200 would just be icing on the cake.

[Kayaker72]

I found that the threshold was crossed somewhere between ISO 800 and ISO 1600 on the 7D. Pretty dependable at ISO 800 and less, but I really tried to limit myself to ISO 400 or less. On the 5DIII, I rarely see issues at ISO 2000 or less. The threshold where noise starts to bug me is somewhere between ISO 3200 and ISO 6400 on the 5DIII, but I've taken shots at ISO 12,800 that are good.

This is why I don't expect the 7DII to meet what I want. Ultimately, it would almost need 1-1.5 stop improvement in high ISO noise and to clean up the low ISO noise.

Rick...that is an interesting question. I am not sure what goes into the "1D" magic. But I firmly believe IQ is more than the summation of the measured technical components. It could be techware or firmware or a combination of the two. But it would be interesting if Canon puts a little of that in the 7DII. We won't know until the reviews and ultimately that may tell us if the 7DII is meant as the successor to the 1DIV. It is an interesting question.

[conropl]

Looking at the spec's other sites are claiming are correct, what are we seeing that is new or groundbreaking?








65 AF point all cross type
EOS iTR Autofocus
RGB + IR Photometry Sensor
Intervalometer
f/8 on center point at least, could be on more points.


These all sound pretty good to me. I am not sure how the RGB + IR metering works, but can't hurt to have more info for metering... and could it help for low light situations??? The iTR Autofocus is a feature not on the 5D III... it is only found on the 1DX... that is nice to have, and does that put the AF system ahead of the 5D III??? The Intervalomter is an "about time" kind of feature, but still good to have w/o buying ML. All cross type points and f/8 autofocus is also a standout for this camera.

It will be interesting to see what the DIGIC6 does for it, and what the noise situation is. The noise, IQ, and to some extent the AF are what drove me away from the 7D. If those are solved here, then it is probably a pretty solid camera for the price (assume that is reasonably under $2k).

Pat

[peety3]

Rick...that is an interesting question. I am not sure what goes into the "1D" magic. But I firmly believe IQ is more than the summation of the measured technical components. It could be techware or firmware or a combination of the two. But it would be interesting if Canon puts a little of that in the 7DII. We won't know until the reviews and ultimately that may tell us if the 7DII is meant as the successor to the 1DIV. It is an interesting question.
IIRC, a lot of the 1D magic is the caliber/quality of the analog amplification between the pixel and the A/D converter. I think the 1-series has analog amplification at the full-stop increments, while still using bit math for the one-third-stop increments. Other series might be all digital, or at least of a lesser quality.

[jrw]

On the topic of 1D images I find that the things I notice is better colour rendition and that the micro contrast is superior.
On the 7Dii front I'll believe it when I can hold one in my hands. Too much speculation and too many very long lead times in delivery for me to think that a product that hasn't even been announced will be in stores soon.
Definitely interested in a crop sensor for pixel density it it meets the same image quality standards as my full frame and H sensor bodied. Until then, not so much.

[HDNitehawk]

On the topic of 1D images I find that the things I notice is better colour rendition and that the micro contrast is superior.


AF system, and your two items. Those are the things that I see that set the 1D's apart.

[Rocco]

I'm hopeful. Numbers are arbitrary, generally. I can't wait to see some sample images. Looking for an excuse to stick with crop sensor... I would be lying if I said I was 100% willing to ditch the ef-s 17-55mm f/2.8 to switch to full frame.

Hoping this impresses and I'll keep my 7d as a second body for wedding and event gigs.

[Photog82]

The GPS and 65 focal points have sold me... I'll be pre-ordering once it's possible.

[Lumens]

The GPS and 65 focal points have sold me... I'll be pre-ordering once it's possible.

Here you go!!!! http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?is=REG&Q=&A=details&O=productlist&sku=1081808 (http://www.The-Digital-Picture.com/ShoppingEngine/Click.aspx?b=903&u=http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1081808-REG/canon_9128b002_eos_7d_mark_ii.html)

[Rocco]

Was just going to post that! According to the video on the page, it is in fact a new sensor... Anxiously awaiting a review from Bryan!

[HDNitehawk]

7D II really? This day actually arrived?
http://www.the-digital-picture.com/News/News-Post.aspx?News=11512

[Kayaker72]

Pretty exciting. Looks like an excellent camera.

[Sean Setters]

I may be ordering the 7D II even before Bryan does his full review. I know there's a few projects I'd like to have it for...

[Rocco]

Too much to hope for spot metering to be being tied to the auto-focus point?

[Kayaker72]

I may be ordering the 7D II even before Bryan does his full review. I know there's a few projects I'd like to have it for...

Great. I'll be happy to hear how it goes. It seems like a great camera. I still need to figure out how to get a little more reach than the 5DIII @ 400 mm. The 7DII paired with a 400 mm lens could be the answer. Or one of the 600 mm zooms/Canon big white, etc. One of the "holes" I eventually need to fill in my kit. But, I am in no rush.

[Sean Setters]

Too much to hope for metering being tied to the auto-focus point?
Yep, too much to hope for. Spot metering uses center focus point.

Just hit me that the camera won't be available until November. Dangit. I suppose I'll have to use my orig. 7D at a couple of upcoming weddings (as a second camera to my 5D III).

[HDNitehawk]

Was just going to post that! According to the video on the page, it is in fact a new sensor... Anxiously awaiting a review from Bryan!

Rocco, where did you see this? I watched the video CR posted and didn't see a video on TDP.

The release said this In addition, the EOS 7D Mark II is the second EOS DSLR camera to incorporate Canon's innovative Dual Pixel CMOS AF system for rapid and precise focusing of video as well as still images.

[Kayaker72]

Rick....off of Scott Kelby's video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M03hu1diCqE&feature=youtu.be).

"Brand new 20.2 MP sensor...."

Then at B&H, (http://www.the-digital-picture.com/News/News-Post.aspx?News=11514) as Rocco said, they specifically say it is not the same sensor at the 70D.

...of course, "Brand new" could just be minor changes to the 70D sensor.

[Rocco]

An offhand comment on the bhphoto press release. (already linked) There's a video at the top. Of course it's just an overview, so he doesn't go into many specifics.

[M_Six]

Looks like an incredible value. I'm really stunned that it's priced under $2k. I would think this might dig into 1Dx sales. Cannot wait for Bryan's review.

[DavidEccleston]

According the these guys, http://www.dpreview.com/previews/canon-eos-7d-mark-ii , spot metering is linked to AF point (see the comparison table).

[Rocco]

According the these guys, http://www.dpreview.com/previews/canon-eos-7d-mark-ii , spot metering is linked to AF point (see the comparison table).
Oh please let it be true!! You just made my day.

[Kayaker72]

Another (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BGDKBcXnVps) review. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BGDKBcXnVps)

Was intrigued, apparently they were assured that the sensor was all new and "built from the ground up." Also, new microlenses. Also it appears that HDR mode was called "adjustable dynamic range" ;)

And CNET (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zQmNsLxtkMk) and some cool shots from Canon Europe (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OAJBbrGs6JY).

[Rocco]

That lever around the joystick! Great feature.

[Sinh Nhut Nguyen]

I'm more interested in how well that new AF system tracks BIF and high ISO performance compares to the 1D X. Overall an impressive camera! Seems like yesterday when I was drooling at the Original 7D.

[HDNitehawk]

Everything looks good and I have it in the basket to buy at B&H, at $1799 its not to bad.

Here is what bothers me, I see where it says you have an expanded ISO.
But no mention of improved noise reduction. Normally Canon throws hints out but I do not see anything that tells me I will now be able to shoot at a higher ISO than the old 7D. Did the 70D have improvement in that area?

[M_Six]

Everything looks good and I have it in the basket to buy at B&H, at $1799 its not to bad.

Here is what bothers me, I see where it says you have an expanded ISO.
But no mention of improved noise reduction. Normally Canon throws hints out but I do not see anything that tells me I will now be able to shoot at a higher ISO than the old 7D. Did the 70D have improvement in that area?

That's why I'm waiting for some reviews. And after our recent trip where we walked miles every day, I'm serious considering a lighter rig for travel. Maybe the Fujifilm X-T1 or some such thing.

[HDNitehawk]

That's why I'm waiting for some reviews. And after our recent trip where we walked miles every day, I'm serious considering a lighter rig for travel. Maybe the Fujifilm X-T1 or some such thing.

That was my thought with the 7D II, decrease size and weight from the 1D IV.

[Kayaker72]

The max native range of the 7D was ISO 6400. 7DII is 16,000. I believe that is meant to imply that we have ~1.3 stop improvement of usable ISO. I do wonder if that will be jpg, as I would be very surprised if they achieved that with RAW.

But, to answer your question, yes, the 70D did have better noise performance according to DXO

2274

About ~1/3 stop better? But, the more I hear, I am not expecting the "70D" sensor in the 7D II. It sounds like several of those that were able to preview the 7DII asked about the sensor and were told it is all new, built from the ground up. I am, guardedly, encouraged.

[ChadS]

Saw mention of the f/8 AF on center point. Is that confirmed? For those of us on a budget it would be really nice to use AF with a 2X teleconverter on an f/4 lens.

[HDNitehawk]

When the 1D X was released part of the improvement with noise reduction they advertised was in camera and could have been duplicated in PP. A portion was not.
I suppose it will be the same here.

But.....

I already hit the pre-order button. If it doesn't pan out I will give it to my brother like I did with my old 7D. He is due for an upgrade and Christmas is coming.

[HDNitehawk]

Saw mention of the f/8 AF on center point. Is that confirmed? For those of us on a budget it would be really nice to use AF with a 2X teleconverter on an f/4 lens.

The release says f/8 so it probably is. Is it confirmed in actual use......:confused:

[Sean Setters]

According the these guys, http://www.dpreview.com/previews/canon-eos-7d-mark-ii , spot metering is linked to AF point (see the comparison table).

From all the official material I've seen, I must say - I believe DPReview is incorrect. From the spec sheet, "(3) Spot metering (approx. 1.8% viewfinder at centre)"

[Rocco]

From all the official material I've seen, I must say - I believe DPReview is incorrect. From the spec sheet, "(3) Spot metering (approx. 1.8% viewfinder at centre)"
After my initial excitement I did some looking around and came to the same conclusion. It's a shame, really.

[Photog82]

I'm going to call B&H tomorrow and ask for more information on the new battery, it's very pricey- I usually like to have an extra one on hand when shooting events.

[Raid]

Just been going through the Canon Digital Learning Center articles and I'm impressed with the new view finder. I always found myself having to look through the viewfinder, then put on my glasses and back to the top display, now it's all in one.


http://www.learn.usa.canon.com/resources/articles/2014/eos7dmkii_intelligent_viewfinder.shtml

[jamsus]

I'm very curious to see the results with some High-ISO sample pictures, not for the 7dII itself which probably i will not buy, but for the future of the APS-C sensors, to have an idea of what are we reaching or what we will see in a few years

Here:

they seem to have a few shoot (i don't know if those shots are from a trusted source)

http://www.cameraegg.org/canon-eos-7d-mark-ii-sample-images-movies/

[Kayaker72]

Its very early and I will want to see controlled tests, but, to my eye, the low ISO noise is much cleaner and there is an improvement at ISO 3200 and ISO 6400 over the 7D. I would not say to the FF levels, but an improvement over previous cropped sensor cameras.

That could just be improvements in-camera jpg processing or was accomplished in post (a few images did look a bit soft at 100%). Controlled tests are needed. I remain guardedly optimistic, but so far, there may be something to the new sensor.

[Kayaker72]

Matt Granger just posted this (http://mattgranger.com/7d2) from Photokina

[HDNitehawk]

Matt Granger just posted this (http://mattgranger.com/7d2) from Photokina

It would have been nice if he hadn't missed focus on the ISO 3200.

[Kayaker72]

It would have been nice if he hadn't missed focus on the ISO 3200.

Or underexposed ISO 6400

:rolleyes:

[HDNitehawk]

OOF really doesn't matter when looking at noise, just look at the Bokeh it is OOF anyway.

The ISO 3200 shot looks like what I would expect with ISO 3200. Nothing out of the ordinary and really minimal improvement. It looks like it isn't bad enough that LR5 wouldn't clean it up nicely. If it can get to 3200 and be cleaned that would be good.

No ground shaking ISO noise improvement with this body, if it had it I think Canon would have been boasting about it.

[HDNitehawk]

Or underexposed ISO 6400

:rolleyes:

Yea, it makes me worry about the other parts of the camera now. :)
AF missed, exposure missed.....

I hope I got mine ordered quick enough to go out on the first round of shipments from B&H

[Kayaker72]

Yea, it makes me worry about the other parts of the camera now. :)
AF missed, exposure missed.....

Yep...its officially a bust.... ;)

Another video. (http://vimeo.com/106236109)...This one really only talks about the "process" that went into the 7DII.

[HDNitehawk]

No manual for it yet but Canon has sales literature up.
They are claiming low noise levels.
They say this is an all new sensor designed for the 7D II

http://usa.canon.com/CUSA/assets/app/pdf/camera/brochures/EOS_7D_MARKll_brochure.pdf

[HDNitehawk]

Optimized for low-light shooting, the EOS 7D Mark II’s sensor
captures images at up to ISO 16000 (expandable to
H1: 25600 and H2: 51200). This is because of an improved
higher sensitivity photodiode construction, CMOS circuitry,
and color filters with higher light transmittance. As a result, the
EOS 7D Mark II records both still and moving images at higher
ISO speeds with remarkably low noise, making excellent
low-light photography and moviemaking possible.

[Raid]

Yep...its officially a bust.... ;)


Unable to watch the Video because of my slow internet, but looking at the pictures and text he didn't say what lens he was using? Does anybody know?

[Kayaker72]

Optimized for low-light shooting, the EOS 7D Mark II’s sensor
captures images at up to ISO 16000 (expandable to
H1: 25600 and H2: 51200). This is because of an improved
higher sensitivity photodiode construction, CMOS circuitry,
and color filters with higher light transmittance. As a result, the
EOS 7D Mark II records both still and moving images at higher
ISO speeds with remarkably low noise, making excellent
low-light photography and moviemaking possible.


They are saying what they need to say. I am still interested in test results, but the images I have seen thus far appear a bit better. But, it is so hard to tell with compressed jpg images.


Unable to watch the Video because of my slow internet, but looking at the pictures and text he didn't say what lens he was using? Does anybody know?

He starts out with the new EFS 24 f/2.8 pancake and at the end puts on the 400 f/4 DO II.

[HDNitehawk]

Unable to watch the Video because of my slow internet, but looking at the pictures and text he didn't say what lens he was using? Does anybody know?

Which Video
The one with the Red Hair girl was a 100mm macro L

[Kayaker72]

Image Resource has a "beta" 7DII. They are comparing it to a 7D.

I see a difference (http://www.imaging-resource.com/news/2014/09/18/canon-7d-mark-ii-first-shots-let-the-image-quality-comparisons-begin)

:cool::D

EDIT: I am seeing very nice differences at both low and high ISOs with their comparometer (http://www.imaging-resource.com/IMCOMP/COMPS01.HTM). Not as good as the 5DIII, but was anyone seriously expecting that?

[Rocco]

Image Resource has a "beta" 7DII. They are comparing it to a 7D.

I see a difference (http://www.imaging-resource.com/news/2014/09/18/canon-7d-mark-ii-first-shots-let-the-image-quality-comparisons-begin)

:cool::D

EDIT: I am seeing very nice differences at both low and high ISOs with their comparometer (http://www.imaging-resource.com/IMCOMP/COMPS01.HTM). Not as good as the 5DIII, but was anyone seriously expecting that?

Yeah. ISO 6400 actually looks semi useable. Not bad.

[M_Six]

The important comparison for me would be with the 1D MkIV. I've toyed with the idea of grabbing a MkIV for BIF shots with its crop factor and AF/high ISO capabilities. The 7D MkII appears to be able to hold its own against the 1D MkIV at 6400ISO. The MkIV has a slight edge in contrast, maybe. But the price difference between a new 7D MkII and a used 1D MkIV really is making it a no-brainer.

[DavidEccleston]

Very nice. Why didn't Canon make it easier to see the improved sensor?

[HDNitehawk]

The important comparison for me would be with the 1D MkIV. I've toyed with the idea of grabbing a MkIV for BIF shots with its crop factor and AF/high ISO capabilities. The 7D MkII appears to be able to hold its own against the 1D MkIV at 6400ISO. The MkIV has a slight edge in contrast, maybe. But the price difference between a new 7D MkII and a used 1D MkIV really is making it a no-brainer.

In November you will hear about my 1D IV vs the 7D II

i can tell you the micro contrast of the 1D IV is a noticeable difference could be the deal breaker.

[M_Six]

In November you will hear about my 1D IV vs the 7D II

i can tell you the micro contrast of the 1D IV is a noticeable difference could be the deal breaker.

If those high ISO images are how it's going to be, then I can already see the difference. And that's looking at a small area at 100%. I bet it's really noticeable when viewing the whole image.

[HDNitehawk]

Image Resource has a "beta" 7DII. They are comparing it to a 7D.

I see a difference (http://www.imaging-resource.com/news/2014/09/18/canon-7d-mark-ii-first-shots-let-the-image-quality-comparisons-begin)

:cool::D

EDIT: I am seeing very nice differences at both low and high ISOs with their comparometer (http://www.imaging-resource.com/IMCOMP/COMPS01.HTM). Not as good as the 5DIII, but was anyone seriously expecting that?


I downloaded one of the CR2 files. It will not open any anything I have.

[DavidEccleston]

Yeah, that's a problem (the not opening CR2s). In the comparometer tool, we're comparing in camera NR from 7D vs. in camera NR from 7D2. The "7D Lab samples" link under the "difference" link above, (or just click here (http://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/canon-7d-mark-ii/canon-7d-mark-iiA7.HTM)), shows in camera NR set to 0 and set to 2. The 0 set might be the best indicator we have of actual sensor noise levels.

[shutterdown]

In November you will hear about my 1D IV vs the 7D II

i can tell you the micro contrast of the 1D IV is a noticeable difference could be the deal breaker.

The lens plays a huge factor in micro contrast, too. Couple the 1.6 FOVC factor, and the new processors, sensor, price, I'd say that the 7DII will hold its own.

[neuroanatomist]

I downloaded one of the CR2 files. It will not open any anything I have.

If you're comfortable with the command line / Terminal, you can download a 70D RAW file and copy the EXIF headers from that file to the 7DII .CR2, and it will open in most of what you have...

[Rocco]

Does Bryan have an evaluation copy already? Anyone know? Or will he be getting his the same time as everyone else? I'm not buying until February, when the tax fairy puts money in my account, but I'm so anxious to read this thoughts and findings! Lets face it, no one does reviews better. He's one of the few that knows the difference between an overview and a review.

[Sean Setters]

Bryan does not already have an evaluation copy. He'll likely be getting his from the first batch of preorder shipments (as will I).

We've tried and tried, but Canon USA is very conservative about evaluation copies. Canon UK is much more willing to loan evaluation gear, which is a big reason why DPReview always has a "First Glimpse" of newly announced Canon products (not that I'm bitter or anything – grrrrr).

[DavidEccleston]

You'd think that TDP was big enough and legit enough that Canon would be rushing to ensure you had everything you needed to tell the world about their latest toys... but I also understand the "gear bought at retail, we have no obligations to Canon" side of reviewing gear too.

[Sean Setters]

You'd think...but that doesn't seem to be the case. :-/

[peety3]

You'd think that TDP was big enough and legit enough that Canon would be rushing to ensure you had everything you needed to tell the world about their latest toys... but I also understand the "gear bought at retail, we have no obligations to Canon" side of reviewing gear too.

I don't want TDP to be receiving special review gear, no matter how "big and legit" it may be - it's better for all of us if Canon doesn't have an opportunity to pick & choose which unit goes to a reviewer.

On the flip side, I struggle with the notion that TDP might pre-order 2-4 copies of something to be able to gather consistency data, while others are anxiously awaiting the 1 copy they've ordered. I'd sure like it if TDP developed a partnership with LensRentals.com such that one (or more) of LR's orders is auto-rented (and potentially direct drop-shipped) to TDP, so that the additional copies needed for consistency turn into rental stock after a reasonable period.

[Sean Setters]

I'd sure like it if TDP developed a partnership with LensRentals.com such that one (or more) of LR's orders is auto-rented (and potentially direct drop-shipped) to TDP, so that the additional copies needed for consistency turn into rental stock after a reasonable period.

Coincidentally enough, that's kind of what Bryan does with some lenses – especially the super-telephotos. He orders a couple of them, tests them, then sells one of them to LensRentals because they can always use the stock. Plus they're usually happy knowing the lens has been pre-vetted and they won't have any initial problems with it.

Typically speaking, Bryan preorders one camera/lens for review purposes. If his test results indicate a problem, that's when he orders additional units to either validate his results or confirm abnormalities. For reviews he feels are greatly anticipated, he may preorder two lenses just in case there is an issue with one (there rarely is) and to also ensure he gets the lens as soon as possible (assuming he orders from two separate retailers, one may arrive before the other).

In the case of the 7D II, Bryan is preordering one for testing purposes and I'm preordering one for personal use.

[conropl]

... On the flip side, I struggle with the notion that TDP might pre-order 2-4 copies of something to be able to gather consistency data, while others are anxiously awaiting the 1 copy they've ordered.

Flipping the flip side... I do not know how many TDP orders; but if it was 2-4 out of the thousands ordered, it is such a small fraction of a percent that it is not really causing any overall heartache to the public in general. In fact, I think the opposite argument can be made. After he is done with them, he sells them as used equipment... so someone gets a fairly new camera with low miles at a discounted price. Seem like he is doing the photography community a service with the review as well as potentially providing a discounted camera.

[conropl]

Looks like Sean already answered while I was typing.

[Sean Setters]

After he is done with them, he sells them as used equipment... so someone gets a fairly new camera with low miles at a discounted price. Seem like he is doing the photography community a service with the review as well as potentially providing a discounted camera.

He does sell some of the cameras/lenses that he reviews on the used market. I acquired the site-reviewed 7D (orig. version) this way...long before I ever worked for the site. :-)

[HDNitehawk]

In the case of the 7D II, Bryan is preordering one for testing purposes and I'm preordering one for personal use.

I am watching, B&H better not play favorites and ship yours first.:D

[Sean Setters]

I am watching, B&H better not play favorites and ship yours first.:D
Hey now, I posted the preorder news as soon as it became available. Don't you think I picked one up first? ;-)

[HDNitehawk]

I may be ordering the 7D II even before Bryan does his full review. I know there's a few projects I'd like to have it for...

Maybe ...:p

My order went in at 2:58 Central Time.

[Sean Setters]

Ok, it's true - I didn't preorder as soon as I put the news up. But I eventually did. :-)

[DavidEccleston]

I'm curious Sean. As a fence sitter myself, what got you off the fence? What features did you see as must haves over your 7D.

There's a small IQ boost at high-ISO, and as we're talking 7D, not-so-high-ISO too.
There's a small pixel count bump.
There's a small framerate boost (okay, +25% isn't so small).
There's improved AF, and AF point coverage.
There's improved movies and STM, but without touchscreen focus point selection, and without WiFi for mobile device focus point selection, I'm not sure how you're expected to fully use the movie mode.
I saw something mention it was compatible with the new ST-E3-RT master thingy, which implies it doesn't have a built in radio master.

What made this a compelling purchase for you? I could see someone upgrading for the AF improvements, but you tend to shoot non-action. Was it all about the not-so-high-ISO noise?

[Kayaker72]

For those interested....http://scottkelby.com/2014/real-world-field-report-on-the-canon-7d-mark-ii/

[Rocco]

Thanks for sharing. I also have zero reservations about it, that video helped. He wasn't just happy with it, he was raving about it. That speaks volumes.

[Sean Setters]

I'm curious Sean. As a fence sitter myself, what got you off the fence? What features did you see as must haves over your 7D.

There's a small IQ boost at high-ISO, and as we're talking 7D, not-so-high-ISO too.
There's a small pixel count bump.
There's a small framerate boost (okay, +25% isn't so small).
There's improved AF, and AF point coverage.
There's improved movies and STM, but without touchscreen focus point selection, and without WiFi for mobile device focus point selection, I'm not sure how you're expected to fully use the movie mode.
I saw something mention it was compatible with the new ST-E3-RT master thingy, which implies it doesn't have a built in radio master.

What made this a compelling purchase for you? I could see someone upgrading for the AF improvements, but you tend to shoot non-action. Was it all about the not-so-high-ISO noise?

Here are the features that sold me:

1) Movie AF - (Biggest feature for me) I've been shooting quite a bit more video lately (purchased a slider and a Glidecam HD4000), and being able to track subjects while panning/following with the Glidecam will be an extremely beneficial feature for me. Yes, I could get that in a 70D (although it's reported that the 7D Mark II does it better), but the other features listed below combined with the Movie AF feature made it a done deal.

2) Movie Recording Time of 29min 59sec - Right now, my EOS 7D stops recording after 4GB of data is recorded (about 10min, give or take). The 7D Mark II automatically generates another file and keeps on recording after the 4GB "limit." This means I have less to worry about if the wedding ceremony lasts longer than 10 minutes. Right now, I have to remember to walk back to my second camera to restart its recording. NOTE: Magic Lantern does have a feature that will automatically start recording again if recording is stopped for any reason. Unfortunately, that setting starts recording even when I manually stop recording with the button. This means that the setting must be disabled in order to use the camera for stills or for anything else (besides filming video). I find that to be a pain.

3) Advanced AF - After having enjoyed the 5D Mark III's AF system for so long, I can't imagine not having it in my backup camera body. The 5D III will still be my main body - because it's full-frame sensor will still be more beneficial for 75% of my portrait/wedding photography business. But whenever using my backup body, it's nice to know that its AF is just as capable and just as dependable as my main body.

4) 10 frames-per-second - This is a huge feature for me. I get by with my 5D III's 6fps when shooting sports, but 10 fps (combined with the advanced AF) will make sports shooting much more rewarding. I don't consider the original 7D's image quality at ISOs above 400 to be good enough for indoor sports – I'm banking that the 7D II's image quality will be.

5) Improved image quality - Granted, I'm comparing the 7D II to its predecessor, but from what I can see, images are sharper and with less noise. Win-win.

By the way, the 7D II's pop-up flash can act as an optical master flash - but you're right, it doesn't have radio communication built-in. No canon DSLRs have that feature...yet.

[Joel Eade]

Famous bird photographer shares an image and initial impression of the 7D II


http://www.birdsasart-blog.com

[HDNitehawk]

Arthur Morris's bird pic looked good. So far the sample pics I have seen I have not been impressed with. All seemed to be to dark in the shadows, they just felt underexposed.

I am looking forward to having one in hand to actually compare with.

[Joel Eade]

Arthur Morris's bird pic looked good. So far the sample pics I have seen I have not been impressed with. All seemed to be to dark in the shadows, they just felt underexposed.

I am looking forward to having one in hand to actually compare with.It looked decent at iso 3200 at least for web presentation....the color looked a bit too purple to me but that was probably post processing. The noise looked very manageable.

[HDNitehawk]

It looked decent at iso 3200 at least for web presentation....the color looked a bit too purple to me but that was probably post processing. The noise looked very manageable.

So far the samples I have seen the noise does look improved over the 7d.
i see the purple to, I wonder if that is what my eye has been picking up in other samples. A bit over saturated with purple would make the picture feel darker.

[Kayaker72]

It looks like Arthur Morris has updated his image and impressions a little bit. The quote that got me is "...At ISO 400 image quality with the 7D II is on a par with 1D X and 5D III images. The image files feature natural, accurate colors."

Granted, a lot of cameras can take good pictures from ISO 100-400. But, that is still a good comparison.

Also, just incase someone missed it:

http://www.the-digital-picture.com/News/News-Post.aspx?News=11670

[HDNitehawk]

It looks like Arthur Morris has updated his image and impressions a little bit. The quote that got me is "...At ISO 400 image quality with the 7D II is on a par with 1D X and 5D III images. The image files feature natural, accurate colors."

Granted, a lot of cameras can take good pictures from ISO 100-400. But, that is still a good comparison.


At first this sounded good but the more I thought about it is not much of a comment. In what context is it as good?

We could go back to the pixel density argument a few years ago. Then through the 1.4x vs the crop factor debate. Then the cropped FF picture vs the crop body debate.

Other than focal length limited situations the FF will rule IQ.

[Joel Eade]

I think he may be referencing noise characteristics, color and contrast and probably nothing more (my guess).

[Kayaker72]

At first this sounded good but the more I thought about it is not much of a comment. In what context is it as good?

We could go back to the pixel density argument a few years ago. Then through the 1.4x vs the crop factor debate. Then the cropped FF picture vs the crop body debate.

Other than focal length limited situations the FF will rule IQ.


I think he may be referencing noise characteristics, color and contrast and probably nothing more (my guess).

Well, I think we all would have been rightfully skeptical had he said it was better than the 5DIII and 1DX. So the comment, for ISO 100-400, is an observation that is in the upper range that I would expect. While there are specific photos I took with the 7D where I would not be able to tell the difference between it and the 5DIII, but to be consistently as good, even in that ISO range, would be an IQ improvement, IMO.

Thus far we have hands on observations from Kelby, B&H, and Morris. I am encouraged as each has said something about IQ improvements. But, until we have production models in the hands of Rick, Sean, and, especially, Bryan, they are just positive observations of beta models.

As to what he could have meant, I think Joel is probably right. Going with DXO, the 5DIII and 1DX outperform the 7D/70D by 1-2 stops in noise, color sensitivity, and tonal range. Low ISO DR is similar (within a half a stop EV), according to DXO, from ISO 100-400. But, if Canon has closed the gap in all of these a bit, good. Going back in this thread, if what Morris is observing relates to bringing some of the D series "magic" (analog amplification, color rendition, microcontrast, etc) to the 7DII. Then great.

We'll see. Overall, I am not expecting something revolutionary. I didn't watch all of Kelby's videos, but scrolled through enough to hear him call the 7DII "the best cropped sensor camera on the market by far" several times. If that is accurate, great. But the disclaimer of "cropped sensor camera" was obvious.

I still doubt I will get one. There is a chance that the 7DII will be part of the most cost effective way for me to get more reach (>400 mm). But I am most interested in seeing Canon produce great products, and watch any improvement made filter up into a 5DIV. Which, I still may not get. I was going through photos I shot of my niece yesterday and I am really not sure I need (maybe even want) more of anything from my camera. The photographer still needs work, but the camera, maybe not. Maybe an even better spread of the AF points as I like to put my subject in the side of the frame.

[HDNitehawk]

Going back in this thread, if what Morris is observing relates to bringing some of the D series "magic" (analog amplification, color rendition, microcontrast, etc) to the 7DII. Then great.


That would be great, those are big items. ISO Noise discussion is meaningless at those levels unless you are a DR nut who likes to underexpose.

The same statement Arthur Morris made could have been made with the 7D vs 5D or 1D IV. The big difference with the 7D was firmware, you had to PP more to get the 7D to those levels. Still the crop will never be able to bring the full range of IQ to the table as a FF will. To me ISO, DR, Resolution are just parts of the IQ package. There is also the abilities of the lens and the aperture. The DOF you can create with a FF. With the FF you have the complete palate of items to work with. With a crop you are limited.

Looking at this 7D II why wouldn't the reviewers rave. It appears to have almost all the features of the high end camera in a body that cost $1799. That's the best bargain I have seen from Canon.

The negatives of the original 7D and why I chose the 1D IV over it were;
AF the 1D IV was better, 98% hit rate compared to 90% with the 7D and 5D II.
AF it took to long to focus with the big tele's
The pictures were flat and I spent to much time PP to bring them up to 1D IV standards
Micro-contrast is better on the 1D IV

So far from the reviews it appears 2 out of 4 have improved.

Why I am looking at buying it;
$1799 is less than 12% of the cost of my super-tele equipment. It is an accessory and worth checking out.
Focal length limited situations.
I am tired of carrying all the weight.

I would not consider buying this body at all if I wanted it for the following;
Taking pictures of the family, the t5i is much more versatile with its flip screen.
Primary creative camera, its crop no way.
Video, maybe, but the flip screen is a huge benefit.

[Sean Setters]

Video, maybe, but the flip screen is a huge benefit.

Maybe, but don't underestimate the importance of the customizability of Movie AF in the 7D Mark II. That feature, in particular, will be extremely valuable to me.

The 70D doesn't allow you to customize how it performs in Movie AF mode. You can't choose for the AF to stay locked onto a subject and to transition more slowly from one subject to another. In my opinion, these features make the 7D Mark II a better tool for video. The results should allow the camera to produce shots much more like traditional focus pulls. And these features makes clean, natural-looking focusing while using a Glidecam possible.

[HDNitehawk]

Maybe, but don't underestimate the importance of the customizability of Movie AF in the 7D Mark II. That feature, in particular, will be extremely valuable to me.

The 70D doesn't allow you to customize how it performs in Movie AF mode. You can't choose for the AF to stay locked onto a subject and to transition more slowly from one subject to another. In my opinion, these features make the 7D Mark II a better tool for video. The results should allow the camera to produce shots much more like traditional focus pulls. And these features makes clean, natural-looking focusing while using a Glidecam possible.

I saw that feature and it looked very interesting.

When I bought a digital body 6 years ago I was making a wildlife photography commitment. I almost decided to go video, I didn't realize I would have both options.

Previous bodies like the 5D II I found useless for video. To hard to use.
The wife has a t4i and I like using it for video. AF works better and is much smoother.
It would be nice if the 7D II is a bigger improvement.
Maybe I will do more video.

[Kayaker72]

Some more hands on experience with beta models:

http://www.foto-buzz.com/index.php?script=page&id=77&type=fotoskool

http://www.popphoto.com/gear/2014/09/hands-canon-7d-mark-ii-dslr-and-400mm-f4-do-lens

http://www.popphoto.com/gear/2014/10/sample-image-gallery-canon-7d-mark-ii-dslr-pre-production

The above gallery has a few photos at ISO 16,000 and ISO 12,800. From what I am seeing Canon has cleaned up the low ISO noise and higher ISO seems pretty good for somewhere between ISO 1600 and ISO 3200. So about a 1 stop gain. I have been trying to think about what I am seeing, but it seems to me that even the higher ISOs compress a bit better than before.

Still, a cleaner low ISO (compared to the 7D) and ~1 stop gain (maybe less) are both pretty nice advances, IMO.

The other interesting bit of information from Andy Rouse's "rolling review" is that he claims the sensor is different from the 70D. We'll see. I'd rather be hearing that from people with their hands on the camera than otherwise.

Caveat that we still haven't seen RAW from production models still applies.

[peety3]

I don't have much to add, other than I got to shoot a pre-production model last week while attending the Peter Read Miller Sports Photography Workshop. It really is a baby 1Dx, and they're doing some unique things to bridge the feature gap. Amongst other things, the AF sensor seems to stretch across the entire imaging space of the (crop) sensor, though not not completely top to bottom. It was appropriately responsive, uniquely customzable, but of course still had that mid-grade feel and sound. Would I buy one? Doubtful, unless the ISO noise gains are better than reported.

[Joel Eade]

More 7D II bird images, some at higher ISO as well

http://www.birdsasart-blog.com/

[HDNitehawk]

More 7D II bird images, some at higher ISO as well

http://www.birdsasart-blog.com/

What I like about his images he is showing PP, most samples I have seen so far have been jpegs.
Looking at his 100% and 200% crop it isn't that impressive. It looks just like the 7D in that it has quit a bit of headroom to PP.

I wonder how many Raw files he will sell at $5 each.

[peety3]

What I like about his images he is showing PP, most samples I have seen so far have been jpegs.
Looking at his 100% and 200% crop it isn't that impressive. It looks just like the 7D in that it has quit a bit of headroom to PP.

I wonder how many Raw files he will sell at $5 each.

I'm just baffled that he can sell the raw files whatsoever. When we got to shoot the camera at the PRM workshop, they put a card in the slot and taped the door shut. We were told to shoot a selfie first, then shoot what we wanted, then shoot a blank frame. The next morning, they went through everything and stripped the EXIF data referencing the camera model. Obviously we're just "ordinary people" not "Canon Explorers of Light" like AM, but I'm still surprised he has the liberty to distribute the files whatsoever.

[Joel Eade]

I wonder how many Raw files he will sell at $5 each.That is sorta crazy....typical though...I don't believe he does much of anything that doesn't revolve around trying to generate revenue but I really admire his work and the blog is educational.

[HDNitehawk]

That is sorta crazy....typical though...I don't believe he does much of anything that doesn't revolve around trying to generate revenue but I really admire his work and the blog is educational.

He should include the finished version so people can see how their PP skills compare. That would give him another angle.
It appears he didn't miss the RAW file opportunity.

His work is great, my only fault with his reviews is that he is always selling. Because of that I always watch out for the bias.

[DavidEccleston]

Add me to the list of people who have pre-ordered the 7DII w/ 18-135 STM and 24-70f/4L. The 18-135 is for video use, so the fact that it's not perfectly sharp, or super fast, is acceptable. The 24-70 f/4L because it's $920 off when purchased with the 7DII. Why Canon is pushing the 24-70 with a crop body I don't understand, but my 1Ds2 will enjoy it's new toy, replacing the used, discontinued, 28-70 f/3.5-4.5.

You can blame Stuart's 70D high-ISO example shots for my order. I know I plan to. (Sorry Stuart ;) )

[Joel Eade]

Comparison images with 7D II and 5D III with same lens from same distance.........

http://www.birdsasart-blog.com

[HDNitehawk]

Comparison images with 7D II and 5D III with same lens from same distance.........

http://www.birdsasart-blog.com

That was enlightening. The results are very similar to what we found in the old 7D vs 5D II debate.
I think with more comparisons you see more of the same.
A bit less noise with the 5D III and the 7D II just a bit sharper.


The deciding factor for me with the older version was the AF system.

My guess is that what we find with the 7D II is that in focal length limited situations that the 7D II will be equal to and possibly just a bit better than the FF bodies. Weight is a big difference making it a good option for my wildlife camera.

[Kayaker72]

Add me to the list of people who have pre-ordered the 7DII w/ 18-135 STM and 24-70f/4L. The 18-135 is for video use, so the fact that it's not perfectly sharp, or super fast, is acceptable. The 24-70 f/4L because it's $920 off when purchased with the 7DII. Why Canon is pushing the 24-70 with a crop body I don't understand, but my 1Ds2 will enjoy it's new toy, replacing the used, discontinued, 28-70 f/3.5-4.5.

You can blame Stuart's 70D high-ISO example shots for my order. I know I plan to. (Sorry Stuart ;) )

TDP forum....helping each other spend more money since 2005.... ;):p

Congrats David.....The more I read, the more impressed I am.

[HDNitehawk]

Add me to the list of people who have pre-ordered the 7DII w/ 18-135 STM and 24-70f/4L. The 18-135 is for video use, so the fact that it's not perfectly sharp, or super fast, is acceptable. The 24-70 f/4L because it's $920 off when purchased with the 7DII. Why Canon is pushing the 24-70 with a crop body I don't understand, but my 1Ds2 will enjoy it's new toy, replacing the used, discontinued, 28-70 f/3.5-4.5.


This must be a Canadian thing, at least I didn't see that combo at B&H or Adorama.

[HDNitehawk]

7D II shipping on October 30th.

I wouldn't hold your breath on this one. I have pre-ordered before.
I have pre-ordered at the local camera store and I have received my order two weeks before Adorama and B&H shipped the first batches.

http://www.the-digital-picture.com/News/News-Post.aspx?News=12718

Hopefully the 7D II isn't postponed for months like the 1D X. If anyone remembers the 1D X was announced before the 5D III and the 5D III beat it to the shelf.

[DavidEccleston]

This must be a Canadian thing, at least I didn't see that combo at B&H or Adorama.
Yup, it's a Canadian thing, plus I can register my pre-order and get some gift pack with a 7DII jacket, and a mini replica of Canon's first camera and some other things... but I give up my option to return the camera. I think I'm going to skip that part of the pre-order bonuses.

[shutterdown]

Does anyone know if the 7D battery will work in the new 7DII? They have a similar designation, except for the N.

[Haydn1971]

Does anyone know if the 7D battery will work in the new 7DII? They have a similar designation, except for the N.

I've read elsewhere that the new N batteries are backward compatible in the 7D/6D/5DIII etc but the old ones don't work in the 7DII

[Kayaker72]

Does anyone know if the 7D battery will work in the new 7DII? They have a similar designation, except for the N.

From Canon USA's website (http://www.usa.canon.com/cusa/consumer/products/cameras/slr_cameras/eos_7d_mark_ii#Specifications):

"Battery
1 Battery Pack LP-E6N (or LP-E6)

With AC Adapter Kit ACK-E6, AC power is possible,
With Battery Grip BG-E16, two battery packs (LP-E6N or LP-E6) can be used. Or six AA-/LR6 batteries can be used"

Located near the bottom of the webpage.

I've actually read it both ways online, but, to me, Canon is saying that you can use the LP-E6 battery with the 7DII.

[sedwards]

i remember from one of the reviews someone said it it the same battery but higher milliamps for the new one.

[Kayaker72]

i remember from one of the reviews someone said it it the same battery but higher milliamps for the new one.

Yeah, I was looking for the details....so far, I've only found this:

Availability
The EOS 7D Mark II Digital SLR camera is scheduled to be available through authorized Canon dealers in November 2014 for an estimated retail price of $1,799.00 for the body only and $2,149.00 bundled with an EF-S 18-135mm f/3.5-5.6 IS STM lens. It will utilize a new LP-E6N lithium ion battery pack with increased storage capacity. The LP-E6N is fully compatible with the LC-E6 battery charger, which will be supplied as a standard item in all EOS 7D Mark II body only and zoom lens kits. Also scheduled to be available are the new optional Battery Grip BG-E16 and optional Wireless File Transmitter WFT-E7A Version 2, with shipping dates and estimated retail pricing to be announced at a later date. Both the EOS 7D Mark II camera and Battery Grip BG-E16 are backwards-compatible to the current LP-E6 lithium ion battery pack.

[peety3]

I've read elsewhere that the new N batteries are backward compatible in the 7D/6D/5DIII etc but the old ones don't work in the 7DII

If it's of any relevance, LP-E4N batteries from a 1Dx are backward compatible in older LP-E4-enabled 1D cameras (1D3, 1D4, and 1Ds3), LP-E4 batteries work in a 1Dx (with albeit less capacity). Both batteries are compatible with both chargers (LC-E4 and LC-E4N), though there's a 10% capacity reduction in one or more combinations (can't remember which). I've had a couple of surprises where one of my LP-E4* batteries "woke up nearly dead" in one of my cameras, but I can't remember the exact combo and it has been infrequent (so not a trend).

[Sean Setters]

The 7D II will accept the older LP-E6 batteries. The only difference in the new batteries is a slightly larger capacity.

[shutterdown]

Excellent. Thanks, everyone. That OEM N version is pricey. I'll be able to use what I have, til the 3rd party batteries show up. :)

[DavidEccleston]

FYI, I got a shipping notice. Looks like the revised Oct 30th date was the real deal. It was last seen by Canada Post, working it's way through Mississauga (Toronto essentially), at 5:30 Eastern, scheduled to arrive tomorrow morning.

[Kayaker72]

Great. Looking forward to your impressions.....BTW, I was in Mississauga a couple of weeks ago. The locals I met with, without prompting, were very adamant that they were not Toronto. ;)

[HDNitehawk]

I called the local camera store today. They said they would start selling the 7D II tomorrow. However they are only selling the kits not body only.

[DavidEccleston]

So, I've only taken a couple test shots in the office, JPG only, with the 24-70mm f/4L IS, reviewed on camera... noise levels look awesome. I can see some mild chroma noise at ISO12800, but ACR should be able to fix it up no problem (whenever Adobe gets around to updating PS/LR). I should be able to post some images later tonight. I passed the camera off to Magda at lunch time, so there should be plenty of data. ;)

In the preview, Bryan mentioned not liking the new zoom controls during image review... I have to agree. I'll get used to it, but, ugh, WHY?!?

Brant, you know, most people who adamantly swear they aren't something, often are.

[HDNitehawk]

Per B&H the 7D II body only is scheduled to be received on 11-3-14 at their warehouse.

[Kayaker72]

Brant, you know, most people who adamantly swear they aren't something, often are.

Ha! too true....

[Photog82]

Per B&H the 7D II body only is scheduled to be received on 11-3-14 at their warehouse.My body will be arriving tomorrow. I was able to get them to upgrade me to free overnight to compete with Adorama. :)

[HDNitehawk]

My body will be arriving tomorrow. I was able to get them to upgrade me to free overnight to compete with Adorama. :)

Was yours kit or body?
I preordered mine the day it was announced.

[DavidEccleston]

So, I'd say ISO 6400 is good enough to use for full sized images, whereas with the 7D, I'd tend to limit myself to ISO 800-1600. ISO 12800 and 16000 are easily usable for web-sized shots. How much this changes when using a proper RAW converter instead of in-camera JPG, remains to be seen.

These are straight from camera, a bit of a crop on Bran's image (the black one), default camera settings. Both with the kit 18-135mm STM.

https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5602/15670234155_3c0bff51ee_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/pSJ3EX)
7DmkII - ISO6400 (https://flic.kr/p/pSJ3EX) by namethatnobodyelsetook (https://www.flickr.com/people/15493374@N03/), on Flickr

https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3948/15667555091_d6ec79b4f8_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/pSujhc)
7DmkII - ISO6400_2 (https://flic.kr/p/pSujhc) by namethatnobodyelsetook (https://www.flickr.com/people/15493374@N03/), on Flickr

[DavidEccleston]

These two from the 24-70, straight from the camera.
https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5607/15484139438_9a4eef0247_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/pAhgcm)
7D mark II - ISO 12800 (https://flic.kr/p/pAhgcm) by namethatnobodyelsetook (https://www.flickr.com/people/15493374@N03/), on Flickr

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7524/15050183803_ba3069c92b_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/oVW8iD)
7D mark II - ISO 16000 (https://flic.kr/p/oVW8iD) by namethatnobodyelsetook (https://www.flickr.com/people/15493374@N03/), on Flickr

[Photog82]

Was yours kit or body?
I preordered mine the day it was announced.
Body only and I ordered it within the hour of it being available to pre-order. I had called B&H first thing this morning to upgrade the shipping. I'm looking forward to getting to know the camera this weekend just in time for a wedding on the 8th.

[conropl]

These two from the 24-70, straight from the camera.


The dog looks really good on the ISO 16000 one, but the background is a little iffy. However, it is the in-focus subject that matters more. Impressive.

[HDNitehawk]

Body only and I ordered it within the hour of it being available to pre-order. I had called B&H first thing this morning to upgrade the shipping. I'm looking forward to getting to know the camera this weekend just in time for a wedding on the 8th.

I like B&H great return policy and prices but when you have to talk to an individual you get bad info.

This evening mine shipped.

I talked to a Rep in chat this afternoon and he tells me it will not ship till the 3rd. I was going to ask for a next day upgrade because of Adorama's offer also. I didn't bother because they tell me it will not ship till Monday. It would have been nice to have it this weekend.

[Photog82]

So far I am really enjoying the new camera. I plan to take it out this weekend and test it out as well as some portraits. The only complaint that I have so far is the zoom buttons, it'll take some time to get used to the new method to zoom. I did notice that my Sigma Art 1.4 is having focusing problems on this camera, I'm going to have to test it out a little more but I hope this isn't the norm as I use this a lot for portraits.

[neuroanatomist]

So far I am really enjoying the new camera. I plan to take it out this weekend and test it out as well as some portraits. The only complaint that I have so far is the zoom buttons, it'll take some time to get used to the new method to zoom. I did notice that my Sigma Art 1.4 is having focusing problems on this camera, I'm going to have to test it out a little more but I hope this isn't the norm as I use this a lot for portraits.

The 7DII quite likely has the same feature as on other recent bodies, where you can configure the Set button to zoom to 100% at the AF point selected for the shot, then zoom out/in with the main dual. I far prefer that to a bunch of button presses.

Hard for Sigma to reverse engineer the AF system of a camera before launch. That's a downside/risk with 3rd party lenses. If it's a bona fide issue, Sigma should have a firmware update for the lens at some point.

[Photog82]

It seems to be a problem more so inside when the lighting isn't as bright which is the whole point of buying this lens. I really hope that this can get resolved.

[Kayaker72]

I like Rick's thread and will leave it for those that actually own the camera. Just wanted to point out that dxomark (http://www.dxomark.com/Cameras/Canon/EOS-7D-Mark-II)has posted their review. I do not pay attention to the single "sensor score" and they are never particularly kind to Canon. But I do look at the individual measurements.

From what I see, a lot of similarities to the 70D sensor. At low ISO, signal to noise ratio, tonal range and color sensitivity are the same. The 7DII does begin to pick up ~1/3 stop at higher ISOs. The dynamic range of the 7DII is better for almost the entire ISO range tested by about 1/2 stop.

That said, it is very similar to other crop sensor cameras out there. Comparing it to the Nikon 7100 and Sony 5100, noise and tonal range are almost identical. Especially the Nikon and Sony have higher DR at low ISO, but they even out quickly and by ISO 1600 the 7DII and Sony are essentially identical. The Nikon continuous to hold a ~1 stop advantage. Color sensitivity, the Nikon/Sony hold a 2/3-1 stop advantage.

All that said, the images coming in with the 7DII seem better than that too me. So, I am interested to keep hearing how others are finding the camera. Plus, you can not discount non-sensor aspects of photography.

[peety3]

Body only and I ordered it within the hour of it being available to pre-order. I had called B&H first thing this morning to upgrade the shipping. I'm looking forward to getting to know the camera this weekend just in time for a wedding on the 8th.

Either mad props or best of luck to you. I bought my first 1Dx 13 months ago, and I don't know the AF system 100% yet, nor am I disciplined enough to go into the menus as conditions change and make adjustments (let alone the RIGHT adjustments). I know it's tough to leave a new camera at home, but do consider going with what you know, as the new toy might give you some surprises your clients won't like.

[Falstaff]

Sigh... My battery grip arrived today. Sure wish I had a body to attach it to...

[DavidF]

My 7D Mark II arrives later today - along with cloudy skies, 30 MPH winds and temps falling into the 20's by evening...sigh. Not ideal conditions for outdoor shooting, but I'll be out there trying it out anyway.

[shutterdown]

Speaking of batteries, leaving the GPS enabled is a lot like leaving your car lights on overnight.
By morning, the battery is pretty much dead....:(

[Sean Setters]

Speaking of batteries, leaving the GPS enabled is a lot like leaving your car lights on overnight.
By morning, the battery is pretty much dead....:(

I've been leaving GPS disabled unless I really want it enabled for a specific purpose. I imagine that's how I'm going to use it, typically speaking...

[shutterdown]

It sure has been a long delay for the camera raw update for the 7DII. I remember Adobe updating cameras within a few days of their release, but it seems like the 7DII is taking much longer.

[DavidEccleston]

I'm not sure what the delay typically is... this is actually my first *new* camera. T1i was refurb. 7D was used from local another dog photographer who upgraded to a 5D3. 1Ds2 was used from Adorama. The wait is infuriating.

[Joel Eade]

Just use DPP 4.0 It works quite well.

[shutterdown]

Just use DPP 4.0 It works quite well.
I have been using it, but sparingly. It's not Adobe CR, though. ACR is far more versatile and the controls are much better.

[peety3]

I have been using it, but sparingly. It's not Adobe CR, though. ACR is far more versatile and the controls are much better.

One option, though tedious, is to use DPP to convert CR2 to TIFF, then "start" your workflow (using TIFFs instead of CR2). Added complexity, but you keep the control you're used to having and you haven't thrown away any bits in the process.

[HDNitehawk]

Just use DPP 4.0 It works quite well.

Actually I have been disappointed with DPP and the 7D II. There is not much head room for improvement and I am not sure if it is the camera or DPP. If it is the camera it does say quit a bit about the 7D II's in camera performance, but I am hoping that when LR does an update I am able to improve with RAW files.

[shutterdown]

One option, though tedious, is to use DPP to convert CR2 to TIFF, then "start" your workflow (using TIFFs instead of CR2). Added complexity, but you keep the control you're used to having and you haven't thrown away any bits in the process.
Great minds think alike: that's exactly how I do the workflow with DPP. I don't bother with any of the DPP features, except to open the TIFF.

[Joel Eade]

I don't have a 7DII but with the 1DX DPP 4.0 does very well. I like the color rendition and noise control a little better than ACR.

It has a set of adjustments and sliders very similar to ACR and, to me, it seems to work very well.

Arthur Morris has been having good results using it with the 7DII......www.birdsasart.com

[Joel Eade]

One option, though tedious, is to use DPP to convert CR2 to TIFF, then "start" your workflow (using TIFFs instead of CR2). Added complexity, but you keep the control you're used to having and you haven't thrown away any bits in the process.Yes....that is how I use ACR as well....just to make some basic adjustments then convert to a 16 bit tiff then on to Photoshop CC.:)

[Raid]

Have just been reading the review below and it's very interesting (if somewhat challenging at times).

http://www.clarkvision.com/reviews/evaluation-canon-7dii/

It's sad that we lost Daniel to the dark side.

[Kayaker72]

Thanks for the link. Compare it also with the data at sensorgen (http://www.sensorgen.info/), and the 7DII sensor has made some nice improvements. Quantum Efficiency is up to 59%, much lower read noise at lower ISOs, and low noise from thermal dark current.