Advice Needed on monopods and monopod tilt heads

Hi Everyone,


Yep, it's Denise again with advice needed...again! [:$]


I just received my 580EX II yesterday and it is just as awesome as everyone said it would be and I am sooo happy i purchased it! Thanks to all that helped in the decision process!!


Now, it is time for me to "focus" on the next needed accessory! Due to budget restrictions, I am thinking of getting a monopod instead of a tripod. Plus, I do have tripod that came with my kit that I can still use with a light lens. I also think I would be more inclined to use a monopod more than a tripod due to ease of mobility (I assume).


So this post actually is two-fold. Feedback would be appreciated on pros/cons of using a monopod instead of a tripod and ...


I am looking at possibly getting the GM 5541 monopod and the Benro DJ-80 Monopod Tilt Head for when I take pictures of my flowers and of birds. Has anyone had experience with using this tilt head or could you recommend one that I should consider? Will this tilt head work with this monopod? My heaviest equipment I will be using is my 300mm f/4L w/ 1.4x II extender & 580EX II on my Rebel T1i.


Thanks again!


Denise

In my opinion, you already have what you need for now, so don't rush to get a monopod. Wait a bit and practice, and when you are comfortable with it drop the $$ on a tripod. I just personally don't like monopods.


well, just my advice [:)]


brendan

I concur. It seems like your targets (flowers and birds) are either long range or require a very steady hand. Neither of those is what monopods are all about. A monopod is not a cheap alternative to a tripod, but a totally different animal entirely. If you said you were shooting fast-moving field action sports, then we're talking monopod, but your desires seem to be pointing you towards a good steady lightweight tripod, with a good tripod head.


I am just suggesting this because I own one, but with the budget you are proposing based solely on the Gitzo 5541, have you looked at the Bogen Manfrotto 055CXPRO3? That is a great tripod for the money. It is carbon fiber, with magnesium hardware, and it seems very strong and stable. It is incredibly light, like 2+ pounds, and can be made to be a very stable vertical macro mount by re-orienting the center column 90 degrees.


As brendan said, too, if you already have a good platform, save your money for something else. New glass, perhaps?

I have a junky (OK, it's not so bad...) "camera store brand" tripod that I bought for $75. I use it occasionally. It's tedious to set up, attach the proprietary plate to the bottom of the camera, and wiggles/jiggles a lot. I have a cheapo monopod with no tilt head - it just screws into my lens or camera.


I use the tripod when shooting still things. It's about useless to use following moving things, so I use the monopod instead. Admittedly, it's not an easy monopod to use, but it works.


Last month, I rented the 17mm tilt/shift. Since my tripod is too big for a suitcase, I rented a LensRentals "light weight" tripod for the week that I was in PA. Drool, drool, drool. Yep, it's light, but WOW was it sturdy and easy to use. It truly changed how I shoot still things, and in small ways it probably changed how I shoot handheld. Upon return to TX, I used my junky tripod for a photo contest, and realized why I didn't use that tripod too often.


All that leads to this: a quality tripod is now very high on my list. I will probably get an exact copy of what I rented, except for the lens plates (I want the Really Right Stuff angle brackets for my cameras - they just make so much sense).


My suggestion? Plan your purchase carefully - proper RRS camera plates for your camera(s), proper plates for any lenses with tripod feet, etc. Buy the tripod first, even though it's more expensive, but only when you can afford the plates and such. You can use the tripod as a monopod, but you can't use the monopod as a tripod.


Oh, and read this: http://www.bythom.com/support.htm

I'll second (or third or fourth) the above advice - for your subjects, a monopod is not the answer, you need a tripod. I'd definitely recommend a carbon fiber tripod, Gitzo is excellent and expensive, Manfrotto is very good and mid-priced, and I wouldn't go lower than that. The 055 series is a bit taller and has a higher load capacity, but if you're not a tall person the 190 series will be fine and will support your equipment as long as you get a good ballhead (488 or 322 if you like the handgrip).

I use a monopod on a regular basis. More so than my tripod, which is currently gathering dust.....


I use a Manfrotto 679 stick, no head, though I do have the little manfrotto flippy head with QR.


Tilt heads are ok, I personally don't like them all that much, and if you squat or bend, you can get more or less the same range with the 300 connected via the tripod collar (I have this same lens as well)


With proper use, a monopod can be just as steady as a tripod.

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Originally Posted by Ehcalum

With proper use, a monopod can be just as steady as a tripod.
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Uh, sorry but no. You can't do things like a 30-second exposure, accurate manual focus with thin DoF, panoramas, and/or shift photography on a monopod (at least to the same caliber as on a tripod).

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Originally Posted by peety3

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Originally Posted by Ehcalum

With proper use, a monopod can be just as steady as a tripod.
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Uh, sorry but no. You can't do things like a 30-second exposure, accurate manual focus with thin DoF, panoramas, and/or shift photography on a monopod (at least to the same caliber as on a tripod).
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I meant for regular shots that she's looking to do. I've shot plenty of panoramas and macros and manual focus on a monopod. Just takes practice and experience.

<span style="font-family: 'Verdana','sans-serif'; color: black; font-size: 9pt;"]Since I have been struggling with the very same decision let me throw my 2 cents worth in. Like others have said,strongly consider the tripod,I know money is an issue, but what you save now, you will spend again down the road---2-3 fold. At my experience level (2 years),I have recently discovered that a good tripod is as necessary as a good lens forsharp photos. I know there are photographers out there that can pull off a tack sharp image hand held,but I think they are the exception rather than the rule. I have recently decided to spend the same amount of money on a tripod that I would on an L series lens.<span style="mso-spacerun: yes;"] As far as the monopod goes,<span style="mso-spacerun: yes;"] I have one and I love it,<span style="mso-spacerun: yes;"] but I would never place a monopod on equal ground as a tripod.<span style="mso-spacerun: yes;"] Monopods have their purpose---if your chasing a sporting event,<span style="mso-spacerun: yes;"] need quick or easy to handle support, then the monopod is the right tool,<span style="mso-spacerun: yes;"] but when stability is the paramount issue---think tripod.<span style="mso-spacerun: yes;"] Regarding tripods,<span style="mso-spacerun: yes;"] I discovered that my $200 aluminum Bogan-Manfrotto failed miserably as it transmitted a high frequency vibration even on a concrete floor indoors.<span style="mso-spacerun: yes;"] A vibration I could actually see at 400mm , live view x10.---how could I expect sharp images with stuff like this going on. <o:p></o:p>


<span style="font-family: 'Verdana','sans-serif'; color: black; font-size: 9pt;"]So, My recommendation---by a good carbon fiber tripod,<span style="mso-spacerun: yes;"] if you can&rsquo;t afford it now,<span style="mso-spacerun: yes;"] save for a few months, then get a good tripod.<span style="mso-spacerun: yes;"] While your saving, you can practice your handheld craft, post processing etc..<o:p></o:p>


<span style="font-family: 'Verdana','sans-serif'; color: black; font-size: 9pt;"]Hope this helps,<o:p></o:p>


<span style="font-family: 'Verdana','sans-serif'; color: black; font-size: 9pt;"]Bob<o:p></o:p>

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Originally Posted by peety3

I have a junky (OK, it's not so bad...) "camera store brand" tripod that I bought for $75. I use it occasionally. It's tedious to set up, attach the proprietary plate to the bottom of the camera, and wiggles/jiggles a lot. I have a cheapo monopod with no tilt head - it just screws into my lens or camera.


I use the tripod when shooting still things. It's about useless to use following moving things, so I use the monopod instead. Admittedly, it's not an easy monopod to use, but it works.


Last month, I rented the 17mm tilt/shift. Since my tripod is too big for a suitcase, I rented a LensRentals "light weight" tripod for the week that I was in PA. Drool, drool, drool. Yep, it's light, but WOW was it sturdy and easy to use. It truly changed how I shoot still things, and in small ways it probably changed how I shoot handheld. Upon return to TX, I used my junky tripod for a photo contest, and realized why I didn't use that tripod too often.


All that leads to this: a quality tripod is now very high on my list. I will probably get an exact copy of what I rented, except for the lens plates (I want the Really Right Stuff angle brackets for my cameras - they just make so much sense).


My suggestion? Plan your purchase carefully - proper RRS camera plates for your camera(s), proper plates for any lenses with tripod feet, etc. Buy the tripod first, even though it's more expensive, but only when you can afford the plates and such. You can use the tripod as a monopod, but you can't use the monopod as a tripod.


Oh, and read this: [url="http://www.bythom.com/support.htm]http://www.bythom.com/support.htm[/url]
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Your suggestions have been very helpful and thank you so much for the link. There was so much truth in it that it was humorous! I shall wait it out until I can afford a quality tripod and realize now I will be so much more ahead!


Thanks again!


Denise

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Originally Posted by neuroanatomist

I'll second (or third or fourth) the above advice - for your subjects, a monopod is not the answer, you need a tripod. I'd definitely recommend a carbon fiber tripod, Gitzo is excellent and expensive, Manfrotto is very good and mid-priced, and I wouldn't go lower than that. The 055 series is a bit taller and has a higher load capacity, but if you're not a tall person the 190 series will be fine and will support your equipment as long as you get a good ballhead (488 or 322 if you like the handgrip).
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Thank you! I think I see a Manfrotto in my future with a ballhead for sure! I am only 5'4" so I don't need the height as much as I need for it to hold the weight of my equipment well.


Denise

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Originally Posted by HiFiGuy1

I concur. It seems like your targets (flowers and birds) are either long range or require a very steady hand. Neither of those is what monopods are all about. A monopod is not a cheap alternative to a tripod, but a totally different animal entirely. If you said you were shooting fast-moving field action sports, then we're talking monopod, but your desires seem to be pointing you towards a good steady lightweight tripod, with a good tripod head.


I am just suggesting this because I own one, but with the budget you are proposing based solely on the Gitzo 5541, have you looked at the Bogen Manfrotto 055CXPRO3? That is a great tripod for the money. It is carbon fiber, with magnesium hardware, and it seems very strong and stable. It is incredibly light, like 2+ pounds, and can be made to be a very stable vertical macro mount by re-orienting the center column 90 degrees.


As brendan said, too, if you already have a good platform, save your money for something else. New glass, perhaps?
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Thank you for educating me, I was definitely looking at the wrong thing for my needs. The only fast moving shots I will be taking is of my dogs and a bike race occasionally. My toddler grandchildren are not quite fast moving as of yet [:)]


Since I have quite a bit to save for, I have plenty of time to look at whats out there for good tripods, I know it will definitely be carbon fiber and I will take a look at the one you've suggested. Thanks!


Denise

I am currently saving the $$$ for tripod, flash, and 15-85mm EFS lens. (tripod at top of list)


I suggest you wait. Then get a gitzo systematic 2541 or whatnot for some ridunculous price and feel totally awesome. Don't rush.


BTW, yes, Manfrotto is good. But Gitzo :: Manfrotto = Mercedes::Ferrari.


Brendan

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Originally Posted by bburns223

I am currently saving the $$ for tripod, flash, and 15-85mm EFS lens. (tripod at top of list)


I suggest you wait. Then get a gitzo systematic 2541 or whatnot for some ridunculous price and feel totally awesome. Don't rush.


BTW, yes, Manfrotto is good. But Gitzo :: Manfrotto = Mercedes::Ferrari.


Brendan
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I definitely will wait but I don't ever see me spending quite that much on a tripod. I only spent the $$ on the 580 EX II because my internal flash was giving me problems but it was pretty pricey for me. I will definitely wait and save...and save and with any luck, maybe by the time I'm ready financially someone will be selling a nice used one. I've never in my life spent this much money on myself for a hobby and I don't think a new "Ferrari" is in my future. I just bought myself a Nissan Murano a few months ago and I love it so if I can find a tripod in that class ...I'll be happy. [:D]


Denise

Denise,


First of all, I am flattered that you value my advice. I am also new to this hobby. I kind of made the same move that Peety3 did, too. My first tripod was an aluminum Sunpak 7500TM, which actually has a built-in monopod, but has a funky non-standard quick release plate, too. It isn't a terrible tripod, but there is a WORLD of difference between that and my new one.


If you are interested in the Manfrotto 055CXPRO3 that I mentioned, just know that it is height adjustable, and built more sturdily than the 190 series, in my opinion. Don't underestimate the value of having beefier, larger diameter legs. That is also why I chose a three segment over a four segment like the 055CXPRO4. Keep in mind that it still only weighs a couple of pounds total. Couple that with the fact that it sells for less than a 580EX II flash, and you are good to go. I actually got mine for only $360 at my local camera store, because it was an unused floor model. I don't think it had been out of the box for a month if you want to know the truth.


Anyway, I also have a Manfrotto 3047 three-axis head that I really like, and I've seen a couple on eBay go for $70-80 used. I struggled with choosing between it and an awesome (huge!) Graf StudioBall ballhead with panning and everything. That thing is large enough to support my Land Cruiser, I do believe! Anyway, for the kind of shots I want to do, I felt like only having to worry about controlling a single axis at a time was beneficial, and got some valuable advice about the possibility of a ballhead allowing the camera to flop over dangerously if you aren't careful with big lenses attached. Also, the ball head didn't have a bubble level, and the Manfrotto actually has one on two different axes. I am friends with the current owner of the StudioBall, and I'll probably end up with it, too, but I chose the 3047 first.


The advice on plates for the body and collared lenses is very sound. I have a Kirk L-plate for my Nikon D100 and a Kirk plate on my Sigma 400mm lens. The Manfrotto and the StudioBall both had corresponding QR platforms, too. You will find that Really Right Stuff, Kirk and Wimberley all have high quality pieces in this genre, and the prices are similar. Others do too, I'm sure, I just don't know about them. I haven't gotten any for my 40D yet, but that's coming soon!


Anyway, if you have any specific questions about the gear I've got, I'll be happy to discuss it with you.


Cheers,


Philip

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Originally Posted by bburns223

I am currently saving the $$ for tripod, flash, and 15-85mm EFS lens. (tripod at top of list)


I suggest you wait. Then get a gitzo systematic 2541 or whatnot for some ridunculous price and feel totally awesome. Don't rush.


BTW, yes, Manfrotto is good. But Gitzo :: Manfrotto = Mercedes::Ferrari.


Brendan

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So, that makes the RRS carbon fiber tripod the McLaren F1 of tripods? [:D]

Using a monopod for a long exposure is
a joke. Flat out there is no monopod that can do what a good tripod
can do. Why would anyone want to use the wrong tool to do any
job?Sure a monopods better then nothing say like when your holding a 300
2.8 or 400 2.8 lens but that response was a joke. For Ehcalum to even
mention the words with experience in the same sentence that was funny. I wish I could learn how to control my shaky hands through more experience. I
just had to comment on this and back up peety3. Theres a place
for a monopod and a place for a tripod where a tripod is absolutely
an essential tool to have.

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Originally Posted by freelanceshots

Using a monopod for a long exposure is a joke. Flat out there is no monopod that can do what a good tripod can do. Why would anyone want to use the wrong tool to do any job?Sure a monopods better then nothing say like when your holding a 300 2.8 or 400 2.8 lens but that response was a joke. For Ehcalum to even mention the words with experience in the same sentence that was funny. I wish I could learn how to control my shaky hands through more experience. I just had to comment on this and back up peety3. Theres a place for a monopod and a place for a tripod where a tripod is absolutely an essential tool to have.
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It wasn't that I wanted to use the wrong tool, it was being as new to this as I am, I did not realize I was considering the wrong tool for my needs until a number of extremely helpful people explained the differentpurposes for each. I will be saving for a tripod but Ehcalum's experience is paying off because in my opinion the photos posted in his profile are wonderful! Since I am just beginning, I am learning a lot about the gear I need (and don't need)from everyone on this site which is for the professional and the hobbyist like myself.


Denise

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Originally Posted by ddt0725

Thank you! I think I see a Manfrotto in my future with a ballhead for sure! I am only 5'4" so I don't need the height as much as I need for it to hold the weight of my equipment well.

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I myself use a Manfrotto 190CXPro3 with 488RC2 ballhead. It's light to about 1.3kg + weight of the ball head and can support up to 5kg. If you won't be grabbing any lenses heavier than Canon 100-400 L and/or 70-200 f2.8L, this should be enough for you. I tried my friend's 055XPro and it's very very heavy. If you walk around a lot, the weight would put down on you. Being 5'6", my 190CX is just a bit taller than me compared to my friend's 055XPro which when fully extended, you cannot press on the shutter quite easily.





Go give it a try.

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Originally Posted by ddt0725

It wasn't that I wanted to use the wrong tool, it was being as new to this as I am, I did not realize I was considering the wrong tool for my needs until a number of extremely helpful people explained the differentpurposes for each. I will be saving for a tripod but Ehcalum's experience is paying off because in my opinion the photos posted in his profile are wonderful! Since I am just beginning, I am learning a lot about the gear I need (and don't need)from everyone on this site which is for the professional and the hobbyist like myself.


Denise
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Thanks for the props Denise. I wish you best of luck and joy with your photography.


People do not give the monopod enough credit. There are many different ways to hold a monopod, the most use way, just in front of your legs and in the center, is the least stable. I shoot sports, primarily, and wildlife. Freelance, I shoot surfing on a weekly basis in the summer with a 400 2.8 and a 500 F4 using the monopod. A tripod is not the correct tool for use on the beach with surfers, I have never seen anyone on the sidelines in a soccer game or a football game with a tripod and a 400 2.8. I shoot sports, primarily, and wildlife. I'm lucky, I can handhold a 300 f4 or a 70-200 2.8 for hours and with a steady hand, God and years of piano and the french horn gifted me the ability of strong steady hands.


I don't hate tripods, I just prefer the monopod. I have a decent tripod myself, and yes I do use it on occassion. Tripods, even carbon fiber ones will always be bulky in my opinion, and take a bit of time to setup, level. For the record, I depending on the lens, I can hand hold down to 1/5 of a second, without IS (IS is an entirely different rant of mine) [img]/cfs-file.ashx/__key/CommunityServer.Components.UserFiles/00.00.00.24.72/monopod_5F00_400.jpg[/img]

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Originally Posted by ddt0725

It wasn't that I wanted to use the wrong tool, it was being as new to this as I am, I did not realize I was considering the wrong tool for my needs until a number of extremely helpful people explained the differentpurposes for each. I will be saving for a tripod but Ehcalum's experience is paying off because in my opinion the photos posted in his profile are wonderful! Since I am just beginning, I am learning a lot about the gear I need (and don't need)from everyone on this site which is for the professional and the hobbyist like myself.


Denise
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Thanks for the props Denise. I wish you best of luck and joy with your photography.


People do not give the monopod enough credit. There are many different ways to hold a monopod, the most use way, just in front of your legs and in the center, is the least stable. I shoot sports, primarily, and wildlife. Freelance, I shoot surfing on a weekly basis in the summer with a 400 2.8 and a 500 F4 using the monopod. A tripod is not the correct tool for use on the beach with surfers, I have never seen anyone on the sidelines in a soccer game or a football game with a tripod and a 400 2.8. I shoot sports, primarily, and wildlife. I'm lucky, I can handhold a 300 f4 or a 70-200 2.8 for hours and with a steady hand, God and years of piano and the french horn gifted me the ability of strong steady hands.


I don't hate tripods, I just prefer the monopod. I have a decent tripod myself, and yes I do use it on occassion. Tripods, even carbon fiber ones will always be bulky in my opinion, and take a bit of time to setup, level. For the record, I depending on the lens, I can hand hold down to 1/5 of a second, without IS (IS is an entirely different rant of mine) [img]/cfs-file.ashx/__key/CommunityServer.Components.UserFiles/00.00.00.24.72/monopod_5F00_400.jpg[/img]

No question that monopods are great tools for their intended use. But the type of shooting you're doing determines the support you'll need. In addition to the 300mm, Denise also has the 100mm L Macro and stated an interest in taking pics of flowers. Getting any sort of reasonable DOF in macro shooting requires long exposures (several seconds, sometimes) - a monopod, no matter how it's held and regardless of the experience and steadiness of the hands of the user, just is not going to permit exposures of that length.