Neutral Density Filters

Good Morning All -

I currently have only 2 ND filters, both are B + W #103 8x (58mm & 72mm). I am looking to purchase another that will give me more dramatic & creative effects. One that will give me smooth effects for water & fog (I spend a great deal of time at Lake Michigan but also hoping to take some trips and photograph waterfalls), blur motion of vehicles, bikes, clouds and of course dogs! I think these can even make distractions somewhat invisible. I am not sure if I can get all of this in one ND filter or if I need possibly 2 different ones(?) Also, is it ok to use step up rings for this much ND or will it possibly produce negative effects that I don't want? Is it best to go with a graduated ND filter?

These are the choices I picked out so far on B & W so far ....

Hoya Pro 1D 16x (4-stop)
Hoya x400 2.7 Multi-Coated (HMC) Glass
B + W #106 1.8
B + W #110 3.0
Singh-Ray Mor-Slo
Singh-Ray Vari-ND (I'd have to wait awhile longer for this one, price is somewhat painful)

or wait for the Big Stopper to become available?

Suggestions and/or photos w/ EXIFof what I'm trying to capture extremely appreciated!

Thanks!

Denise

Denise-


I have a 77mm 2 stop B&W ND filter that works great. However, I often find myself needing to block more light. I also currently own a 58mm Light Craft Workshop Fader (variable) ND filter. After several sessions, I

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sean Setters

, I've recently purchased a well-reviewed Genus Variable ND filter from B&H (well, at least the 77mm version is well-reviewed...I purchased the 58mm one). It isn't a regularly stocked item, so I won't get it for probably another 3 weeks or so. If it meets or exceeds my expectations, I'll buy a 77mm one too.


If the Genus filter works well, it'll be well worth the relatively inexpensive price.

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I just took a look at those after reading your post. Please let me know your opinion of it after you've had a chance to try it out. Even if I purchase something now, I still may want to get one of those also.
Thanks, Sean!

Denise

No problem. I

One issue I have with the variable ND filters is the 'cross effect' you get at wide angles. It's analogous to the uneven polarization you see in the sky with a CPL on an ultrawide lens, since variable NDs are essentially stacked polarizers. It seems you get the effect if you rotate the ring too far with any focal length, but you apparently get it with lower ND settings with wide and ultrawide lenses - the very focal lengths I most want to use a strong ND filter.

All I can say, if it was ever even considered, was "don't go cheap". I got my 3 stop non variable ND filter from TIffen for $15 (52mm for my nifty fifty so it was that cheap). It does it's job but I'm noticing severe Chromatic Aberrations when shot into the sun. You get what you pay for. [:S]

Sean - Did you by chance try out the Genus yet? I did end up buying a B&W #106 ND but B+H just emailed me that the Genus Fader ND is in stock in the size I was looking for but thought I check on your opinion of your before ordering.


Denise

I haven't gotten it yet. I assume it'll ship out soon now that they have stock.


EDIT: They still don't show stock of the size I bought. So, maybe a bit longer...

Hi Denise,


I use the B+W #110 3.0 (10 stop) ND filter and I haven't noticed any degradation in image quality. I'm able to get 20 sec + exposures in broad daylight at around f/16 so it certainly can give you some opportunities for creative shots.


The only gripe I have with it is that it does produce a warmer tone than shooting without it. However, if you shoot RAW this is easily fixed inpost with a temperature adjustment. Here's an example of a shot I took in the desert out here in the middle of the day.


5D2, 24-70mm f/2.8L @ 24mm, f/20, ISO 100, 20 sec exposure. The halo around the tree on the right isn't due to the filter/lens, it's more due to lazy post processing on my part.


http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4113/...9fb37798ef.jpg
Simpson Desert Series # 2 by Ben__Taylor, on Flickr


Cheers, Ben.

Hi Ben -


This is no doubt the creative effects I would like to achieve and I debating on this filter for the longest time. After reading many reviews that stated it was virtually impossible to see thru the viewfinder with this filter and that you pretty much had to focus without the filter in place and then put the filter on and take the shot, I decided against it. Do you experience any focusing problems with it? My lens kit is pretty well complete and I am looking at various filters, etc. now to enhance creativity. Something like this filter would get a great deal of use considering I am surrounded by various lakes & rivers.


Denise

You cannot meter or AF through a 10-stop ND filter (at least, I can

Denise, neuro is correct - you cannot autofocus using this filter. You can JUST (read: barely) see through the viewfinder to compose provided you have a bright day. I do the same as John, focus at the hyperfocal distance using the lens scale, most of the time but otherwise you will have to compose and focus then attach the filter. It

Since Live View on the 7D simulates exposure, you could set up a tripod and use Live View set to an exposure of a few seconds (whatever enables you to see the shot on the LCD) and use 10X focus magnification to manually focus with the heavy ND filter. I just tried it with my LCW Fader ND and it worked decently well.

I did a brief test indoors just now. With the 7D and 17-55mm, I selected an aperture that gave a 1/30 s exposure, so the 10-stop ND should meter at 30 s. With the ND in place, the scene was way too dark to compose in the VF, AF did not work, and the metering sensor underexposed at 8 s. Live View with exposure simulation was still too dark to compose (Sean, I guess the full 10 stops exceeds the capability of the gain for the simulation, unlike the max density of the fader), AF still did not lock, but the metering off the image sensor was actually correct at 30 s. However, I should mention that I do recall trying this when shooting landscapes, and Live View on the 7D still underexposed.


Then, for kicks, I tried the same test with the 5DII and 24-105mm, at ~27mm so the framing was the same as 17mm on the 7D, and with an aperture set to result in 1/30 s exposure as before. Through the viewfinder with the 10-stop ND in place, the 5DII metered underexposed, more than the 7D at 5 s, and thus outside of the 2 EV exposure compensation range if one was shooting in Av mode. However, the 5DII

Neuro-


Now that I think about it, I didn't have the variable ND filter set all the way to max. I remember turning it to the point where it was dark enough so that I could barely see through the viewfinder, but as I was indoors, the ND might not have been that strong.


EDIT: Ok, just did my test again. The LCW advertises a neutral density strength between 2-8 stops. I could not focus using Live View at the max setting. I was, however, able to focus at the point just before max. So, as Neuro said, using Live View with a 10X ND filter is not possible. However, it looks like it would be possible somewhere between 6-8 stops.

Thanks guys for the info! I think I might go with the Genus ND Fader Filter (2-8 stops) this month and then get the 10-stop B+W ND filter in the spring when I

UPDATE: B&H sent me an email stating that the manufacturer is unable to give them an expected delivery date for the 58mm Genus ND Fader filter. So, I had them change the order to the 77mm one instead. On the one hand, I won't be able to use the filter with my 85mm f/1.8 or 50mm f/1.4 lenses. On the other hand, I will be able to use it with my 70-200mm f/2.8 L IS, 17-55mm f/2.8 IS, and 10-22mm f/3.5-4.5. Honestly, I will never use the ND on the 10-22. However, I look forward to using the Genus 77mm Fader ND filter on my other two zoom lenses.