Tripod Detection System

Does anyone know why the "tripod detection system" would stop working?

As you can see from my other posts, I went to shot Garwin Falls yesterday. I forgot to turn off my IS on the 5DIII + 24-105 combination. I usually do turn off my IS while shooting from a tripod, but I occasionally forget and I've never had a problem.

Until yesterday. About 90% of the shots from a tripod have incredible amounts of blur in them. I wish I would have taken the time to review my shots in the field, but I didn't. After seeing this last night, I thought it could be my tripod slipping on the ice or the IS issue, so I did several test shots around the house. About half the time, with IS on while mounted to a tripod, I had significant blur whereas with IS off, the pictures had no blur each time. I've been through the 5DIII manual and it indicates that there shouldn't be a problem because of the "tripod detection system," which was my understanding

I've tested my 70-200 f/2.8 II, and did not see the same issue. So, it could just be the 24-105 lens.

And, for the back story, I did slip on ice with the 24-105 about 3 weeks ago trying to get a shot for the "Near/Far" assignment. It seemed that the hood protected the lens, but I am wondering if perhaps this is the first sign that something internal is out of alignment.

Any thoughts?

http://digitaljournalist.org/issue0807/tech-tips.html

Chuck Westfall recommends turning IS off when on a tripod for the 24-105L.

I have always turned IS off on my 24-105L because I have seen a noticeable difference when I do not. Not sure that is you problem or if something is broken... just my experience. The only way you are going to know for sure is to send it in to canon service.

I didn't look this up, but I thought the tripod detection thing was a lens by lens thing not a body thing. Some have it and some do not.
Is that not the case?

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Originally Posted by Kayaker72

And, for the back story, I did slip on ice with the 24-105 about 3 weeks ago trying to get a shot for the "Near/Far" assignment. It seemed that the hood protected the lens, but I am wondering if perhaps this is the first sign that something internal is out of alignment.

Any thoughts?

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I think it's time for the 24-105 to visit your friends at Canon.

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Originally Posted by HDNitehawk

I didn't look this up, but I thought the tripod detection thing was a lens by lens thing not a body thing. Some have it and some do not.
Is that not the case?

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It is a lens thing... the camera should not matter. Westfall says all modern lenses since the 90's should have tripod detection. He even mentioned he 24-105mm specifically as having it. But tripod detection does not stabilize for mirror slap, and it does move some prior to locking in position after the shutter button is first pushed (can take up to a second to settle in). So do not push the shutter button to fast. However, the big whites also have a nice feature where the IS goes a step further when on a tripod, and will help to eliminate the effects of mirror slap... so in the case of those lenses, it is recommended that IS be left on (this includes your 500mm).

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Originally Posted by conropl

It is a lens thing... the camera should not matter. Westfall says all modern lenses since the 90's should have tripod detection. He even mentioned he 24-105mm specifically as having it. But tripod detection does not stabilize for mirror slap, and it does move some prior to locking in position after the shutter button is first pushed (can take up to a second to settle in). So do not push the shutter button to fast. However, the big whites also have a nice feature where the IS goes a step further when on a tripod, and will help to eliminate the effects of mirror slap... so in the case of those lenses, it is recommended that IS be left on (this includes your 500mm).

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Thanks, I haven't seen where Westfall said this. I have seen where they talked about the big whites having it.

Brant; Speaking of service I am sure your this lens is one of your older lenses. Maybe check the contacts to make sure they are not dirty?

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Originally Posted by HDNitehawk

Thanks, I haven't seen where Westfall said this. I have seen where they talked about the big whites having it.

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The link below is my source where he talks about IS and tripod detection... he was responding to a pretty lame question, but his answer dove in a little deeper (which was nice). It is a little dated, so his list of lenses does not include the version II of the 500mm and 600mm, but they would be included if it was updated.

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Originally Posted by conropl

http://digitaljournalist.org/issue0807/tech-tips.html

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Brant, did you shoot with a remote? I had visible shake in long time exposures with my EF-S 15-85 on a tripod using the remote. I'm not sure if the EF-S lens simply doesn't have that feature, or if it still activates first (causing an upward shake in bright light sources) before it stabilized, as if it needs a split second to recognize that it is on a tripod. Actuating the shutter button maybe would have allowed that split second before exposure started, but with the remote it somehow did not. Just a theory though, I haven't really tested.


Arnt

Thanks Everyone. I think the bottom line question is has anyone else experience significant (photo ruining) blurring with the IS On while mounted on a tripod? I suspect the answer is no. It could be that this has been the case all along and I've been much better than I recall at turning IS Off when on the tripod. But I doubt it.

@Arnt---I was using the 2 second time delay on Saturday and in my subsequent test shots. This morning I listened and I could hear the IS whirling during those two seconds, so it should have had enough time to settle in.

Everyone else, thanks for you input. I will be contacting Canon and probably sending it in as I suspect there is a problem. I updated to the recent firmware, cleaned the contacts (both lens and body are ~1 year old) and ran a series of optical tests. Fortunately, it checks out optically. My AFMA are essentially the same (0 adjustment at 105 mm from previous and -1 at 24 mm from previous), aperture sharpness test looks great, and the AF consistency test was ~98%. I also tested the IS and it seems to be giving me the ~2-2.5 stops of IS it typically had (I have never been too pleased with the IS on the 24-105. IS is much better on my other lenses, but it is an older generation of IS). I also took a bunch of random shots around the house and they all turned out as expected.

But right after my FoCal tests this morning, I tested the tripod detection system again and instantly saw the problem. First shot with IS Off was sharp. The next four shots with ISO On while mounted on the tripod ranged from minor, but visible, impact to image ruining effect. I'll try to post the pics soon.

Thanks again...seems like it is time to send the 24-105 home for a bit.

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Originally Posted by Kayaker72

Thanks Everyone. I think the bottom line question is has anyone else experience significant (photo ruining) blurring with the IS On while mounted on a tripod? I suspect the answer is no. It could be that this has been the case all along and I've been much better than I recall at turning IS Off when on the tripod. But I doubt it.

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The answer for me is: Yes I do see a difference with IS on... so I always turn it off. And that is with the 24-105mm L.

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Originally Posted by conropl

I have always turned IS off on my 24-105L because I have seen a noticeable difference when I do not. Not sure that is you problem or if something is broken... just my experience.

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Thanks Pat. And I am coming around to the idea that this may be normal behavior for the 5DIII 24-105 combo. I just talked with a Canon rep and they also pointed out that the issue of IS and the tripod detection system would have been exacerbated by the lack of contrast of the snow and ice.

That said, I've also played around with the different lenses I own with IS. For those that don't know, I shot the 7D with the 15-85 from 2010 until February 2013 when I got the 5DIII and 24-105. As you'll see in my tests, the "tripod detection system" works a lot better on the 7D 15-85 combination than the 5DIII and 24-105 combination, at least in my tests tonight.

Here are some test shots, all ~100% crops, 6 sec, f/11, ISO 100:

7D EFS 15-85 @ 70 mm IS OFF

Attachment 2124

7D EFS 15-85 @ 70 mm IS ON

Attachment 2125

5DIII 24-105 @ 67 mm (not same as 7D set up because of 1.6x, but I decided to not reshoot) IS OFF

Attachment 2126


5DIII 24-105 @ 67 mm IS ON (both of the next two shots)

Attachment 2127

Attachment 2128

I took four shots with the IS On for both lenses. Each shot from the 15-85 was pretty close to with the IS OFF. With the 24-105, 1 was good (last shot from above), 3 had a fair amount of blur. And this is with a higher contrast target than the snow this weekend. I also tested the 70-200 f/2.8 II (1 good and 3 blurry), the 100 mm L Macro (all 4 were blurry), and the 100-400 L which faired pretty well (minimal blur in all 4).

Anyway, I find it interesting. It could be that when I forgot to turn the IS OFF it was with the 7D combo and have been pretty good about turning the IS OFF the last year (or shooting higher contrast targets), until Saturday.

Again, thanks for all your input. I really appreciate it.

Brant