7D mark II

i decided to start another thread as not to hi-jack the "show you best bird pics" one.
my thoughts on this dont weigh much because i have never tried anything better than a 7dII . however compared to my 70D the focusing system is much better although i am still having trouble with trying to get sharp in focus images. i have tried just about every subject and situation i can think of but sharp images are about 60%. it a lot better than the 70D but i believe it should be a lot better . my last subject was a horse at about 75 feet focusing on the eye. i tried multiple pocus point combinations , ai servo and one shot tripod , hand held. nothing i did would increase the number of in focus shots. i tried a white horse ,brown and black. i even tried in the sun in the shade and as clouds were blocking the sun. as for iso ,if the light is good and i dont have to crop i can get decent images at 1600 when they are in focus . 3200 is kinda pushing it. is this as good as autofocus gets ? or am i probably doing something wrong ? this camera with all its options is still very new to me. it took me a week to figure out what Joel meant
when he said he uses ai focus surround lol.
if you walk up to a subject in decent light , are you confident it will be in focus or do you take multiple shots just to be sure ?
also for low light ,like i said i am coming from a 70D so i find it will focus in lower light than before , although focus isnt right lol in the same light the 70d would just hunt and never lock on. im not talking dark just a little dim in the shade. i also find it will lok on to subjects at much greater distances. yesterday i was able to lock on a deer at 463 meters with a 400mm+1.4 . of course once cropped there isnt a whole lot of detail left but the 70d had a maximum of about 120 meters ,anything farther and it was manual focus only.

I had to do a AFMA on mine when I first got it. It still had problems.
There might be a learning curve when moved up to it, but that isn't the only problem people are having.
If you use single point AF you should get decent results, and if you did an accurate AFMA then you should be getting keepers.
Mine had trouble with precision, the AF systems ability to hit a small area front to back.
I would get keepers, but then have a portion that just missed critical focus.
FoCal has a option to check AF accuracy, it was scoring in the low 90's.
I sent it in to Canon, they found a few things wrong and sent it back.
On FoCal it is hitting 98% now. So far mine is doing better. I haven't yet been able to check it out on birds in flight or in AI Servo like Joel mentioned.
Others have posted problems with the AF system and Canon made corrections, some have no problem and say it is great.
I suggest you send it to Canon and have them check it out. It just takes a few days.

I am confident the camera will work correctly and I can get sharp images if I do everything right.

1.Using a super-tele lens there are some shooting techniques that can help optimize sharpness and practicing these will help. (you may already be doing this)

2.Very high shutter speeds and stopping the lens down slightly whenever possible will make a big difference in my opinion. Also make sure you perform a micro AF adjustment with your lenses. This is especially true when using the teleconverters.

3.With a static subject at a decent distance, using good shooting techniques and a decent shutter speed you should get sharp images most all the time. Moving subjects and slow shutter speeds make it much more technique dependent and you will get better the more you practice.

4.I do not expect much detail in my bird pics from more than 30 to 50 feet so a deer at 400+ meters would be impossible to see any fine details.

In any case, I seldom shoot just one image of anything whether I trust the camera or not.

If you are doing all the above and still not getting results as expected I would send the camera back to Canon for a check up.

I did afma my lenses with and without the extender. I tried manually using a printed target similar to lensalign and then used focal pro. Both methods are quite consistant but but focal says +4 and test target looks like it should be -6. I have run the tests at least 10 times each and they always give the same results.
I wasnt expecting any detail in the deer pic at 400+ meters but i was quite impressed the camera could lock on to something that far away.

Try this:

Tape a dollar bill on a flat wall with really good light.

Use a tripod and a cable release (or 2 sec shutter delay)

Set the camera for manual mode, AF One Shot, use a single AF point in the center and the highest shutter speed you can, push the ISO if needed to get to 1/1000 sec or faster

Check to see if you can get a sharp image this way. If you can, then try AF Servo mode. If that works then try slower shutter speeds and different ISO settings to see if you can get the camera to miss.

If your camera randomly misses focus with this set up then I think you need to send it in.

Thanks Joel ! I really hope i dont have to send it in but it would be encouraging if i find out its not me lol. I will try that after work.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by sedwards

I did afma my lenses with and without the extender. I tried manually using a printed target similar to lensalign and then used focal pro. Both methods are quite consistant but but focal says +4 and test target looks like it should be -6. I have run the tests at least 10 times each and they always give the same results.
I wasnt expecting any detail in the deer pic at 400+ meters but i was quite impressed the camera could lock on to something that far away.

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Trying to figure out what you are saying.
But if you are using two different methods and getting two different results one of your tests is in error. Since you are saying you are using something similar to lensalign I am going with that one.

well i tried the dollar bill test and i wont have to send in the camera. that sucks cause it means im not as good as i thought i was lol. as for afma , if i use focal the miss rate is much higher. using a target and ruler like lensalign , at least 80% of the shots are sharp. i will kep at this and try figuring out wat im doing wrong. thanks for your help guys .

Technique can certainly cause you to have shots OOF. If you are on a tripod shooting lensalign you should not have a problem.

If you are stationary using single point on lensalign you shouldn't be loosing any.
The problem I had with mine was precision not AF accuracy. When your AF system finds focus it doesn't find the exact same point each time. It might be right dead on with the target on the center or it may be a bit in front or behind. In most instances you will never know this as it falls between the DOF. How much it falls in front or back can vary. If for instance the difference between the variance from front to back is small, you wouldn't notice. However as that variance gets wider you are more likely to have a percentage that are out of focus. The wider the variance the more that will be oof.

If you are only getting 80% on target using a tripod with lensalign, using a 2 second delay in single point AF mode send it in for service.
That isn't acceptable.

I sent mine in, I had a low percentage as you describe. Canon found a few things loose and they recalibrated the camera. It seems ok now.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by sedwards

Thanks Joel ! I really hope i dont have to send it in but it would be encouraging if i find out its not me lol. I will try that after work.

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(Asking a more generic question here) Why do I see this "I don't want to send it in" fear/paranoia so often? I recognize that sometimes the manufacturer will declare a unit OK when it actually isn't, but wouldn't you rather the peace of mind to know that the people who built it have checked it, and either declared it good (for the cost of shipping and perhaps a modest bench fee), fixed it under warranty (for the cost of shipping), or offered to fix issues not covered by warranty (out of warranty or out of scope, for a modest repair fee plus shipping)?

i dont mind sending it in for service but i cant understand having just spent $2100 and then have to spend a couple of weeks without a camera. i dont know how canon service is but every other company i have dealt with in canada is horrible for wait times. i read on another forum that canon is working on a firmware upgrade that should help so i will wait a while and see if that helps. in the mean time i find 80% to be pretty good as its the best i have ever got from a camera .

If you had read the posts from the source of that rumor, you would discount its credibility. The same poster said he sent the camera to Canon and they have had it for five weeks. That they didn't even know how to work on it when it arrived. Instead of fixing it they told him there was a firmware update coming. The rumor didn't come from Canon to the public, but through a service tech that doesn't know how to fix a camera to a customer that hasn't had his camera in five weeks.
He is in Europe not North America.

You may be waiting for a while. There are many people who have had their bodies serviced and now perform as they should. Others are saying their body is performing flawlessly. To me that doesn't indicate firmware.

well i have really been trying hard to figure out if its me or the camera and unfortunately , i think its me lol. i cant figure out what i was doing wrong before but now i am getting consistently sharp images . even at quite low shutter speeds with little light. my bird setup at home only has sun in the morning so to test i went out tonight even though its quite dim after supper. here is a dark eyed junco . not a great image but it shows how sharp it can be and at only 1/80 shutter speed.
out of around 50 shots some werent in focus but i could easily tell it was motion blur or me that didnt have the focus point in the right spot.
7dmarkII
400mm@f5.6
iso 800
1/80
+1 stop exposure compensation
https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8849/...a1499816_b.jpg0V8A2998-Edit by sedwards679, on Flickr

Nothing quite like the double edge of reassurance that the equipment is fine served alongside the realization that the issue is the operator. On the bright side you will be able to track your ongoing improvements in technique! It happens to everyone at some point with new equipment, especially long lenses. They are in a league of their own for revealing the errors of our ways.
Glad that you are getting things worked out.

How much coffee ;)

I am becoming more familiar with the 7D MKII and processing it's images so today I gave a trial at higher ISO settings because it was cloudy and the back yard is now shaded by the trees. I set up in TV mode with +1/3 EC using a shutter speed of 1/500 sec and f/4.5 I set ISO to auto and for this image the camera chose ISO 5000.
To be sure there is noise but using DPP and Topaz DeNoise it is very manageable without extreme settings and the detail seemed to hold up pretty good. Any opinions or experiences on using high ISO with 7D MKII?

http://joeleadephotography.zenfolio....58782475-5.jpg

i havent tried any higher than iso 1600 yet. i moved my bird feeder to a spot that has sun only in the morning so it will be a good place to try higher iso tomorrow after work. that jay looks very good for iso 5000 .

Quote:

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Originally Posted by peety3

(Asking a more generic question here) Why do I see this "I don't want to send it in" fear/paranoia so often? I recognize that sometimes the manufacturer will declare a unit OK when it actually isn't, but wouldn't you rather the peace of mind to know that the people who built it have checked it, and either declared it good (for the cost of shipping and perhaps a modest bench fee), fixed it under warranty (for the cost of shipping), or offered to fix issues not covered by warranty (out of warranty or out of scope, for a modest repair fee plus shipping)?

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I know for me when I initially was looking at sending something in was I am going to be without a camera for 2 weeks and there was always something going on at that time. I could live with the ratio for the time I was looking. I did eventually send it in, but not until I knew that I had two weeks without the need for the photography. Mine was rebel some time ago and it was just needed MA. If it was another body that had a significant flaw and I had a backup camera, I think it would have been easier to send it in. Majority of time, if you call Canon first...they will provide you with a shipping label if your camera or lens is under warranty. At least that is what they use to do.

well here are a few shots i took early this morning and later in the evening with gradually higher iso settings. i downloaded a free trial of topaz denoise but i only used the preset for light raw because i have no idea how to use it. it did clean up some of the noise better than i can in lightroom .
these were all shot with 7DII and 400f 5.6 lens at f5.6

1/500 iso 2000 + 1-1/3 exp compensation


https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7659/...96ebf249_b.jpg0V8A3854-Edit by sedwards679, on Flickr

1/500 iso 2500 + 1 exp compensation

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7685/...2292ed12_b.jpg0V8A3868-Edit-3 by sedwards679, on Flickr

1/500 iso3200

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7660/...be2b5ff6_b.jpg0V8A3835-Edit2 by sedwards679, on Flickr

1/200 iso6400 +1 exp compensation

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7685/...6b2482c4_b.jpg0V8A3931-Edit by sedwards679, on Flickr

there is still a good amount of noise in the last shot but the light level was quite low

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Joel Eade

To be sure there is noise but using DPP and Topaz DeNoise it is very manageable without extreme settings and the detail seemed to hold up pretty good. Any opinions or experiences on using high ISO with 7D MKII?

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Joel,

What I have noticed is that at higher ISO's the 7D II has performed better than past versions. In certain situations that might be a benefit.

But I have also noticed that my acceptable limit for noise in a picture hasn't went up with this body. I imagine with your work you have a certain standard that you are looking for when you finish PP, looking at your work over the last few years I believe you have a high standard. I know with the standard I set for myself the ISO performance didn't really improve that much.

But then there is always the exception even with noise. I do not think this one would have held up with some of the other older bodies. I just like this one regardless if its not that great;

Only PP was done in LR, 1/60 / ISO 6400 / F4https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3939/...4a9b0155_c.jpgCQ2A0915 by hdnitehawk01, on Flickr

this guy was friendly enough to let me shoot a few test shots yesterday . here are iso 800, 3200 and 6400 with no noise reduction applied .
https://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8892/1...a38d4600_b.jpg800 by Stuart Edwards, on Flickr
https://c4.staticflickr.com/8/7765/1...0f5b26db_b.jpg3200 by Stuart Edwards, on Flickr
https://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8799/1...342a302e_b.jpg6400 by Stuart Edwards, on Flickr

Those are Camera JPEGs or from RAW files?

they were shot as raw and converted in lightroom . i made a few adjustments to make the light level look the same on all 3 because i had exposure compensation set to 1-1/3 for the first 2 then just 1/3 for the 6400 pic.

These look good....no doubt that for internet viewing the 7D MKII can certainly make useable images at high ISO. I have not attempted any prints......yet.

Just wondering how you guys like the new location (vertically on the right side in the viewfinder eyepiece) of the ELI when shooting in manual?

A friend just bought the 7DMK2 and I was using it for a little bit and couldn't find the ELI....when I did, I didn't like it......but I was just wondering about those of you who have purchased it and using it on a regular basis now.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bill W

Just wondering how you guys like the new location (vertically on the right side in the viewfinder eyepiece) of the ELI when shooting in manual?

A friend just bought the 7DMK2 and I was using it for a little bit and couldn't find the ELI....when I did, I didn't like it......but I was just wondering about those of you who have purchased it and using it on a regular basis now.

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I remember thinking it was not the same as other bodies I have had when I first started using it. Beyond that when I read this I had to think about it a minute because it I never thought of it as an issue. To me it is a non issue.

I have a harder time remembering the combination of controls to get to little used functions when I switch bodies. Maybe we should complain to Canon and have them standardize all bodies from now on.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bill W

Just wondering how you guys like the new location (vertically on the right side in the viewfinder eyepiece) of the ELI when shooting in manual?

A friend just bought the 7DMK2 and I was using it for a little bit and couldn't find the ELI....when I did, I didn't like it......but I was just wondering about those of you who have purchased it and using it on a regular basis now.

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I just got my 7D2 last week.- For manual mode I have not adjusted to the little hard to see bar on the right side. In my opinion this is an oversite.
The only benefit.. perhaps is I will now make use of Av, Tv and perhaps custom modes... instead of just shooting manual.

I prefer it at the bottom, but don't use it often. Generally just for getting in the ballpark of the correct exposure when I first arrive somewhere.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Kombi

I just got my 7D2 last week.- For manual mode I have not adjusted to the little hard to see bar on the right side. In my opinion this is an oversite.
The only benefit.. perhaps is I will now make use of Av, Tv and perhaps custom modes... instead of just shooting manual.

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No... if you're used to it, you won't want to give up control over shutter speed and/or aperture. Instead you'll dial down the ISO past 100, until it says A. Then you'll run into how annoying it is to change EC when in M mode, and you'll wish the ISO/FEC button was an ISO/EC button when flash isn't activated.

Edit to the above: You can set up the set or the new lever control to be EC when held. The lever+wheel combo is pretty easy to use. Yay!

7D2 and I are finally starting to get along. Was a pretty rough go for a while, wasn't sure the camera and I were ever going to click, as it were.

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1699/...c960484b_k.jpgHanger Light by David Franks, on Flickr

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1638/...172495ec_k.jpgBetty Jane by David Franks, on Flickr

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1646/...a883ca90_k.jpg"TONDELAYO" by David Franks, on Flickr

Looking forward to getting some great shots this airshow season now that I have the hang of it.