Q: (for Pros) Dan Winters like lighting

[Madison]

Hi,





I was wondering: how does Dan Winters manage to create such small spotlights on people yet manage to keep it so very very soft. I know he works on films so he could (in the case of the Ledger photograph) shoot and underexpose a bit and tweak in the darkroom (Leibowitz uses the technique as well sometimes). But in the case of DiCaprio's portrait: the light source is very small yet very soft. Stunning. Like an oil painting from the 16th century almost. I know some people do this with light skimming but really, can it be done that way? I doubt this is skimmed light, or am I wrong?

(And if it is skimmed: I suppose I cannot do that with two monoheads with just an umbrella then? I would need soft boxes right?)





PS: If you are Dan Winters fans, like I am, his very first book was just published! It's great!! It's called Periodical Photographs.





EDIT How stupid am I? The portrait is in the book. He uses a soft box to the right and a slight fill ring (you can see it in detail in the catch lights, duh! WHy didn't I think of this before I opened the topic).





Then the question remains: Could I do this with two umbrellas? One to the right one on axis with the cam as a slight fill?

[peety3]

EDIT How stupid am I? The portrait is in the book. He uses a soft box to the right and a slight fill ring (you can see it in detail in the catch lights, duh! WHy didn't I think of this before I opened the topic).


Then the question remains: Could I do this with two umbrellas? One to the right one on axis with the cam as a slight fill?
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I'm no "pro" at studio lighting, but I'm learning some basic fundamentals: if you want soft light from a small source, you're going to have to work to get it. You could try "double diffusion" with your off-axis umbrella - I usually slap a small piece of Rosco 103 (Tough Frost??) over my speedlites as soon as I decide I want softer light, even if I'm going to put it in an umbrella. You could try that, and/or a sheet of R103 somewhere in the path. I can't speak to how easy/hard it is to substitute for the ring look though.

[Keith B]

You'll need a ring light to get that even fall off. That is where the Ray Light flash adapter is great.


The Ledger pic looks scrimmed soft box. Maybe a fresnel with barn doors?

[Madison]

Thank you both but I am not working with speedlights, I am working with monoheads (Bowens Gemini 400) and umbrellas. Wondering how to achieve the same look with those. Ring Light adapters mentioned won't cut it (although Bowens does make a Ring Lite adapter for the Gemini monoheads I *just* discovered.


I dunno. Will have to start experimenting next week I guess.


I don't think Ledger is Fresnel. Fresnel shadows are different (not so soft, even diffused Fresnel light is different). I was thinking a strop light or a rectangular soft box with a minor fill (shot on film, underexposed when developing).





I love that 'painting' look. It's stunning.

[peety3]

Ah, important details to know. Let me tell you what I know about monoblocks:

[Madison]

Ah, important details to know. Let me tell you what I know about monoblocks:

[:P]

[Keith B]

Thank you both but I am not working with speedlights, I am working with monoheads (Bowens Gemini 400) and umbrellas. Wondering how to achieve the same look with those. Ring Light adapters mentioned won't cut it (although Bowens does make a Ring Lite adapter for the Gemini monoheads I *just* discovered.


I dunno. Will have to start experimenting next week I guess.


I don't think Ledger is Fresnel. Fresnel shadows are different (not so soft, even diffused Fresnel light is different). I was thinking a strop light or a rectangular soft box with a minor fill (shot on film, underexposed when developing).





I love that 'painting' look. It's stunning.

Yeah I was thinking soft box, but it looked scrimmed like barn doors, but that is probably just the oblique angle the SB is hitting the wall at.


I've never used fresnel, I was trying to recall something I read in a Michael Grecco book.


If your lights can work as optical or IR slaves you could use a flash and the ring adapter. It is a less expensive alternative. Just not as pretty but more mobile.

[Keith B]

Finally got around to trying this. I think it is pretty close(a start anyway). My girl was nice enough to sit for this. She wasn't expecting to be posing so she wasn't done up, so be kind.


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5DmkII 24-70 2.8 @70 1/60th 3.2 ISO 50 (didn't feel like stopping lights down again). Key-580EXII reverse fired in Apollo 28" Softbox Fill-580EXII (master) Expoimaging's Ray Flash Background light- 430EX with Honl 1/4 grid.


Not too much post. Just a little.

[Madison]

Keith! That is wonderful!!!!