I finally did it!

[clemmb]

Thanks everyone for the encouragement and advice! I have a few things to consider yet with the above scenerios on exactly how to offer the prints. I just don't think I will go the route of offering everything high-res on a CD/DVD/USB flash drive. If I do that, it sort of defeats the purpose of paying for my zenfolio site. I don't think the average person really understand or appreciates the benefits of high quality prints and would then take the route of a cheaper (to them just as good) route of Walmart. We all know that there is a huge difference! I am picking up two copies of my poster later today at Walmart and I hope it turned out ok! A number of web-sized watermarked shots on CD or USB drive seems good though.

Maybe this was the wrong way of thinking but I was offering a low hourly fee and then if need be due to the extent of the shoot, travel time for multiple locations and work/time involved in the processing, I could always take on slightly more profit onto the prints on my site on a client by client basis.

Lots to consider!

I think you are right about the ave. person. Also I have done family shots for my kids and they have taken a CD of full files to Walmart or Walgreens and were refused to make prints without a release because the photos looked too good to not be pro, Walmart said. For my son's wedding I took a CD to Walgreens to have some posters made and they required me to sign a release even thoght I am the owner of Mark Clem Photography. The posters did come out ok considering it was Walgreens. By the way, My package price for a portrait session is $75 and usually takes 1 to 2 hours so I think your price is good. I do ofter shoot 2 or three locations but they are usually within a few miles so it does not add much time. I have not traveled more than 40 miles for a portrait session so I have not charged extra. I have for weddings. I charge $300 for a wedding that is over 75 miles. Most weddings receptions last pretty late and I do not want to drive that far when I am that tired so this reimburses me for hotel.

[HDNitehawk]

If you are going to charge for the pictures you should post and make known you're pricing structure. Paying $45 for a session and $20.00 for pictures is quite affordable. Having to pay $600.00 for a full set, or $50.00 for 5 pictures on top of you're sitting fee may not seem "affordable" to some and if you didn't make known you're full pricing structure in advance it may feel like a bait and switch to a client. I am not saying those prices are not fair, I am saying make sure you're pricing structure is open and easily understood.

There is more to ones reputation than their work and perception is everything.

[jrw]

With regards to prints, you may at some point consider providing them yourself as you seem to be looking at more of a local market. Any online orders will include the costs of shipping, printing, and brokerage to the website which impact the profitability. The prices from my local print shops, while not unreasonable, are still enough to make it worthwhile to fulfill the typical 8x10 prints myself, especially when I include my time for submitting and pickup. When it comes to canvas however the difference in cost is shocking which is what initially drove buying a large format printer. I mention the canvas as so many of your posts, especially macro, seem to want to be wrapped.

I understand the reluctance to hand over the files and let people print wherever they find the cheapest price or even on the cheap printer at home. One option gaining popularity in my area is to provide FaceBook sized JPEG files (4x6 at 100 ppi), with watermarks, for online sharing as well as a number of prints in an album with the option to purchase more prints of course. At the end of the day, you still need to have a way to get prints to your clients. The options really are limited to online, use local print shops, or do the printing yourself. For a local market I'd choose between the last two. To cover a large geographic area the online fulfillment services would definitely come into their own.

[ddt0725]

If you are going to charge for the pictures you should post and make known you're pricing structure. Paying $45 for a session and $20.00 for pictures is quite affordable. Having to pay $600.00 for a full set, or $50.00 for 5 pictures on top of you're sitting fee may not seem "affordable" to some and if you didn't make known you're full pricing structure in advance it may feel like a bait and switch to a client. I am not saying those prices are not fair, I am saying make sure you're pricing structure is open and easily understood.

There is more to ones reputation than their work and perception is everything.

I am most definitely not trying to set up any type of bait and switch. I am just trying to hear what others think are the best ways to provide the photos.

As I have it setup right now (just talking out loud here) ...

$45 for a one hour session
$15 (USB flash of all photos from the session web-sized, edited and watermarked)
$39 If they chose (1) 8x10, (3) 5x7's, (16) wallets off of my current website pricing, printed by mpix + shipping
Total $99 + shipping

The pricing on my website was setup long ago for if someone wanted to purchase just any photo so it does have some profit worked in. I should set it up for clients with no profit. That would make the above total $73 plus shipping. Does that still seem to high? If it does, then I wouldn't even bother offering them the option from my website and just give them all edited full size photos on a USB for $20 so the entire thing will only cost them $65.

That looks like the easiest and best way to go. $45 for the first hour, $40 each additional, $20 for the full edited set, full-sized unwatermarked on USB.

[HDNitehawk]

Of course you're not doing a bait and switch. Communication is everything when trying to avoid miss understandings with a client.
I just think it's best to lay out the pricing on you're web site and make sure people understand. I didn't see a tab for pricing structure.

I see on some people's site they have a "what do you get for" type of description for the fee's.

Hope this endeavor works out for you

Edit; the prices are very reasonable IMO

[Richard Lane]

Hey Denise,

Congrats on your new endeavor, I know you'll do great!

As far as the business model goes. Don't sell your services too low, you are definitely worth it!!

I don't think you have to pigeon-hole yourself into any concrete decisions right now. Regarding a $20 CD for all of the images, it does sound too low to me.

I think you should offer printing services from your Zenfolio site. Wouldn't it be cool to say that, "I also offer full professional printing options for all of your favorite photos at very affordable rates, and I would be glad to assist you with that once we can view all of the photos. Now if someone is hesitant to that and you think that it will cost you the sale, then you can offer them the USB drive, but I just think $20 sounds too low. Some people also like to view their photos in a digital picture frame. That could be another service that you can offer. As mentioned above, the pictures aren't worth anything to you, so try to get your fee and once you get that, then it really doesn't matter what the breakdown was.

I also think $45 for the first hour is too low, but you can raise that later, as you gain more experience. I would view the hourly rate as what would be your absolute minimum that you are willing to work for.., not for one hour, but for the 'whole job."

For example, another option might be $75 for the first hour, and $25 for the second hour. This way you get a minimum of $75 and lets say that you decide on $25 for the photos on a USB drive. Now, the least that you will make is $100. I'm afraid that if people hear $45 for the first hour then they will just want 1 hour only, so that they wont have to pay you for the second hour. You can also offer $45 an hour, with a two hour minimum. Another technique may be $75 an hour, with buy one hour and get one hour free, and $25 for the USB drive. That's also $100.

To tell you the truth, I would also consider $100 for two hours, this way you're guaranteed $100 and then I would probably include the photos on a USB drive for that price, but also offer to assist them with their printing options and educate them about different print lab qualities and explain to them that you will personally be editing, adjusting and cropping their photos. This way you can make a little something extra on the photos. Also, make it sound a little complicated, so that they will choose your services over Walmart, also let them know there's different types of paper quality, canvas wraps, and borders. You can also offer to host their pictures on your website for a specified time frame with their own private login. So, go with what you like and don't limit your options, and try to get at least $100 for the job.

It's all marketing!

Rich

[Kombi]

I think your package price is extremely reasonable.
- my only experience with family portraits has been at sears
Locally, they lour you in with a low session fee of $29.99 - A disc of the photos was only available of the prints you chose to have printed. for $50

Their printing fees were rediculous.
All said and done for a couple 8x10's half dozen 4x6 and a dozen wallet sized it was about $200 for some soso pictures from a photographer who didn't care if we were there or not.
So for $100 with a photographer with a vested interest in getting good pictures is a deal.

Check out what is being offered in your area, price yourself competitively. Give yourself some room to grow, set your price on par to competition but then you can have an introductory sale, or a July special etc.


--Post Processing
This is something I have wondered. How much time are you spending on editing pictures after a shoot? Do photographers have an additional charge for this? (Sears added $2 per picture to add a vignete or 'special effect')
For my own personal use when I take a few hundred pictures I skim for one's that catch my eye and only edit those pictures, so maybe 20%.

If you spend an additional hour editing the pictures for a 1 hr shoot you should keep that in mind.

Perhaps a price for untouched, and a price for retouched?

[Steve U]

Great ideas coming through on this topic.
Well thought out Rich.

[ddt0725]

These are all fantastic ideas! There are so many ways of doing this, more than I realized I guess! I think the best thing for me to do is to take the ad down temporarily until I have a better idea of how I want to offer this!

I picked up my 8x10 posters that I had done at Walmart and they are nothing like how they look on screen!! They are very dark, cropping was not how I viewed it on their site, it is chopped off too short at the bottom and the colors are all wrong! Sure glad it wasn't a clients photos!

[HDNitehawk]

Don't take you're ad down, all those ideas can be adjusted and implemented later as you go IMO.